Sept. 15, 2025

What's Your Leadership Style?: Unlearning Democratic Leadership

What's Your Leadership Style?: Unlearning Democratic Leadership

Send us a text We explore the democratic leadership style, examining when this collaborative approach works best and when leaders need to pivot to different styles for effective team management. • Democratic leadership involves consulting with team members and valuing collaboration • This leadership style works best with highly skilled, experienced team members • Leaders must properly prepare teams with information, vision, and context before expecting meaningful input • Nelson Mandela and M...

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Send us a text

We explore the democratic leadership style, examining when this collaborative approach works best and when leaders need to pivot to different styles for effective team management.

• Democratic leadership involves consulting with team members and valuing collaboration
• This leadership style works best with highly skilled, experienced team members
• Leaders must properly prepare teams with information, vision, and context before expecting meaningful input
• Nelson Mandela and Martin Luther King Jr. exemplified democratic leadership in building consensus
• Democratic leadership isn't about being liked – it's about effectively developing your team
• Ambitious leaders often move too quickly, failing to adequately prepare teams for shared decision-making
• Not every situation requires consensus – leaders must discern when to make executive decisions
• Leaders should know their natural style but be flexible enough to adapt when circumstances require
• Democratic leadership requires ongoing coaching and development, not just collecting input
• Middle adults must evaluate if their leadership style matches their team's readiness and the situation at hand

Please like, share and subscribe to the Unlearned Podcast! Engage with us in the comments and follow us on Facebook and Instagram.


00:00 - Middle Adult Life and Health Reflections

05:51 - Introduction to Leadership Styles Series

09:49 - Defining Democratic Leadership

15:20 - When Democratic Leadership Works Best

21:53 - Preparing Your Team for Shared Power

31:44 - Pitfalls of Democratic Leadership

42:30 - Finding Balance in Leadership Approaches

54:44 - Episode Wrap-up and Next Steps

WEBVTT

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hello everybody and welcome once again to the unlearned podcast.

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I am your host, ruth abigail aka ra.

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What's up?

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Friends, it's your girl, jaquita it's one of those nights y'all ain gonna lie.

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We can record this kind of late.

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It is kind of late.

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But this is the podcast that is indeed helping you gain the courage to change your mind so you can experience more freedom, and we are very excited to be with you today.

00:00:34.164 --> 00:00:36.411
Very excited, very, very, very excited.

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I think it's been a minute right, it's been a minute, since it's been the two of us, you know what I'm saying.

00:00:42.869 --> 00:00:43.731
Yes, it has.

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So you know, listen Ruth Abigail been out here doing her thing.

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Absolutely, absolutely Now we are back here, in these streets, middle adulting it up Middle adult baby.

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Have you ever thought?

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like what's going to happen when we transition out of the middle adult phase.

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I really don't know.

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I don't want to think about that.

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That's not where I am in my life.

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You know what I'm saying?

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40, is just sitting here going just knock, knock, knock, knock, knock, knock.

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I don't like it.

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Child listen.

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It's way too close.

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Speaking of 40, we were just talking in our little pre-conversation about working out.

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So me and Queda, we've been working out.

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You have to understand this is not.

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You have to understand like this is not something that we are usually doing.

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No, it's not.

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Listen, I would like to say I'm a couple of months in, though.

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You know what I'm saying, so like listen, I feel strong, okay.

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Yes.

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I have a.

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I bought like a.

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Really, normally when I buy sofas, the thing I check is for easy, uh, sit down and get up ability, like that's very important Cause I'm five, 11.

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Okay, I need to be able to pop up and so I bought the sectional.

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She's beautiful, but I did not consider because she's so big and comfortable, I did not consider how low she was, which is normally my first check.

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When I tell you the knees, the knees are so strong I'll be popping up.

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I'll be like I ain't scared of no low couch, I know that's right.

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We pop up, and that's what I wish for every middle adult.

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It's stronger knees ankles wrists.

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Yeah, okay, I love that.

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Joint care.

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It's important.

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It's important you have to get on your game.

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You know the thing, that the indicator for me, one of them is like my ability to balance.

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You know what I'm saying.

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It's like when I'm stretching, if I'm doing all this, it's like hey, we're not in a good place.

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Right, we're not in a good place, right, we're not in a good place.

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But recently, since I've been working out, I've been balancing better.

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You know what I'm saying, like I don't have to hold on to things you know to do my little leg stretches you know what I'm saying Like that's good and I feel like I'm growing.

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Nothing feels better when you do that back leg stretch and you pop that leg up and just catch it, it's nice, it's nice oh we're in there, I got it.

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I got it.

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We're in there, I'm healthy.

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I'm healthy, dadgummit, and so you know, middle adults, you know, get on you.

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This is our, this is our little health promotion.

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You know what I'm saying.

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Get on your health.

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You know what I'm saying Because whatever pace you need to do, the first objective is just to get there.

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Okay your time.

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That's it, it's just to get to the gym.

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Just get there Get to the place where you're going to do the workout.

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That's it Okay.

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Just get there.

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Make that the first goal.

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That's it All right, because once you get there, you're going to be like I guess I'll tinkle around with some things.

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Okay, yeah.

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Just get.

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It is but for you, but like for me, it was the um I.

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I went to a doctor and I saw a number I'd never seen before.

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Amen, I'd never seen it, I just never seen it.

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You know what I'm saying In my life, you know what I'm saying In my lifetime I ain't never seen a number before in my life.

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I said, oh, this can't work, I'm gonna have to do something about this and whatever that is for you, you know what I'm saying.

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You got to have your motivation For me.

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I just don't want to see that number no more Like.

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I'd like to see a different number.

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All right For those of us who have seen a number our entire lives.

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All right, you know.

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But I'm saying no, but I'm saying like in relation, if you saw, a number.

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You're at, you know I'm saying I no, no, no, I completely understand.

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Okay then, but I think for me, listen, I got, I got.

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You know they call it like non-scale victories.

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You know, listen, all right, I'm out here.

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I like I'm out here trying to wear the best clothes I'll come on, I like that, okay, okay.

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And I want to look good.

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That's another thing, absolutely.

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Also, I think for me it was just I knew I needed more energy, like I was like why am I tanking out every day at two?

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That's a great point, you know?

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Like why?

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Why am I like just completely not here, right, and I was like my body has stored up.

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You know, when I think about, like you know, being curvy, okay, being plus, all of the things, right like I'm like my body is storing its energy.

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I needed to use it there, you go, there you go.

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Okay, there, it is there, it is we got sure to do.

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You got things to do.

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Okay, we got things to accomplish and you're over here storing it.

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That's right.

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Okay, that's what the kids be doing, Like I'm ready to go.

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I cannot Anywho.

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I've been watching my wife and kids and you know they do that a lot the anywho, anywho.

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So listen, guys.

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We're here to talk about leadership styles.

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Okay, we are transitioning to a new season of the podcast.

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Okay, last time you guys saw us we were doing movie reviews.

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Come on, man, summer movie.

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That was a great time.

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Millennial movie series what we name it, what was it?

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We had a great time.

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You know what I'm saying.

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So now we are transitioning to talk about millennials at the movies.

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There it is, yeah.

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Yeah, I knew it was going to come to me, but don't be putting me on the spot, honey.

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I didn't know.

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I couldn't remember.

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Now we're transitioning.

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Sorry, producer Joy came back on screen because we acting up.

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Let's get it rolling.

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We're going, we're getting there, folks.

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But we are transitioning to talk about leadership styles and I think what we thought would be really, really beneficial for you all because, first of all, I didn't know until I got into a PhD program that there were names- for different leadership styles.

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Again, I got a master divinity degree.

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We talked about leadership, but in context of the church, and so it's been really interesting to just really kind of break down what leadership styles fit me for the moments that I found myself in through the years and kind of what I'm also having to adopt and evolve into and process through about what leadership looks like for different seasons of your life.

00:07:09.185 --> 00:07:34.608
And I think a lot of times as middle adults listen, we've been doing this thing for a while and you can get in a routine of doing things a certain way, leading your team a certain way, leading processes and leading organizations in a certain way that sometimes we don't realize that the need for innovation is going to require us to change our perspective and our approach.

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And so I really think what we're hoping to accomplish in this season is to one.

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We have seven leadership styles that we're going to kind of go through and really articulate to you guys, give you good examples of what those leadership styles look like in different settings and workplaces and ministry and just daily life, famous people who have kind of used those leadership styles and kind of what some of the kind of strengths of that leadership style is and some potential pitfalls, and so we're going to go through each of them.

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Each leadership style will have its own separate episode, and then we got a finale at the end.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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So what we're starting with this time?

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Right, we're going to start with a leadership style that I think a lot of people are very familiar with and it kind of comes.

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It's one of those leadership styles that's like, oh yeah, like we're familiar with this because this is kind of how we want to live.

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Right, a lot of people desire to live like this and this and this is the.

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The democratic leadership style, right, that is like an ideal leadership style for a lot of people is we want to be democratic, want to involve people.

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You want to.

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You don't want to be a dictator, right, you want to be.

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You want to be.

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You know, people at the table and and and and receive input and all this stuff, and I think that that's a beautiful thing.

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But I think one of the things that is important for us to unlearn is that all these leadership styles don't belong in every season, yeah, or?

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in every setting, or in every setting.

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You may be a democratic leader, and that's your natural style, but every once in a while you got to step over into a different lane, and so you have to know when that's appropriate to do.

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You have to know when it's appropriate, and so one of the things we also want to talk about is like, how do you pivot?

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How do you pivot when you maybe lean naturally one way, but the season of what you're leading actually needs a different style, and so how does that need to look?

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And so we're talking about this democratic leadership style, and so I'll start just by giving a quick definition of what that is right.

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It's basically a demo.

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The democratic leader consults with the team and values collaboration on site.

00:10:05.336 --> 00:10:07.559
That sounds like the perfect leadership style.

00:10:07.559 --> 00:10:10.269
It's like who wouldn't want to lead like that?

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That is obviously the best leadership style for every situation, but newsflash it's not.

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It's a great leadership style for some situations, but not for all situations.

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There are certain conditions in which this style works the best, right.

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One of the things that impacts the impacts that it has is it fosters ownership and empowers your team and encourages innovation.

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Great right.

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And a lot of times, it's ideal for consensus building right and consensus building situations.

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And so I think, within that, one of the things, that one of the first things we want to talk about is okay, quina, when is it, when is it appropriate for this style?

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Like, like.

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Can you, can you describe the situation in which this would be a good way to lead?

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I think it is.

00:11:04.509 --> 00:11:26.610
So the democratic leadership style, also known as, like, the participatory leadership style right, because it is really going to pull everyone into a space where everyone's engaged, where everyone has a voice, right, and everyone is contributing to the movement of the team.

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And so it's going to be really good when you have really highly skilled, highly experienced team members that, especially when you're thinking about, these are people that I want to promote, right?

00:11:41.581 --> 00:11:47.320
These are people that I see moving further than where they are right now in this organization.

00:11:47.320 --> 00:11:48.341
Yeah, right.

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And so I have to start giving you know, because when you think about, kind of like, the way power sits in a democratic leadership style, it's technically, I have the power, but I'm choosing to share it.

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I'm choosing to allow you to have voice in what we're doing and for us to collaborate and build energy and movement and build momentum together.

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I'm choosing to allow you to have authority in the direction of the team, and so the democratic style really says okay, these are people that I trust.

00:12:32.884 --> 00:12:59.647
These are people that I don't have to train, because a democratic style is not going to work if people don't have the competence to do the job Right, and I think that's where we mess up sometimes it is the democratic style is for a room of experts, are young leaders that you are empowering for their next move.

00:12:59.960 --> 00:13:00.520
And that is.

00:13:01.123 --> 00:13:05.113
I would say that in a lot of instances I have had a democratic style.

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I normally think of myself as a transformational leader, but I have a democratic style.

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I have everyone sit at the table.

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But what I say in the beginning I'm like, hey, everything that everybody puts out is not gold, and you have to be mindful that just because you say something don't mean we got to run with it.

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We're all giving voice here.

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I also think that a democratic leadership style is usually comes after a time period of a highly authoritarian leadership style or oppressive leadership style or oppressive leadership style.

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Our oppressive leadership style, because you are one.

00:13:44.932 --> 00:13:52.976
You're having to be sensitive with people, because if you even look like you have the remnants of what we just came out of.

00:13:52.976 --> 00:13:53.918
We're not fooling with you.

00:13:53.918 --> 00:13:55.164
Yeah, that's right.

00:13:55.164 --> 00:13:57.988
We're not going wherever.

00:13:57.988 --> 00:14:06.833
That is Right, and it is the democratic leadership style is so powerful because it gives power back to people.

00:14:07.181 --> 00:14:15.291
That's really good and in certain circumstances that's so necessary, and we've seen that with a lot of political leaders.

00:14:15.291 --> 00:14:22.052
Most notably, the one that I think we're going to focus on a little bit today is Nelson Mandela.

00:14:22.052 --> 00:14:30.764
Is Nelson Mandela right who came into leadership in a time where people in his country, in South Africa, felt disempowered?

00:14:30.764 --> 00:14:40.890
Right when they had been under these you know really, really heavy regimes that were like, really, really authoritarian.

00:14:40.890 --> 00:14:48.764
And then he comes in after, like, the apartheid and after all of the destruction and damage that was done to that community.

00:14:48.764 --> 00:14:53.484
He comes in and says we're in it together, we're moving forward together.

00:14:53.484 --> 00:14:57.072
I got you, you know, what do you want, what do you need?

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Everybody, put your ideas on the table and we're going to create consensus.

00:15:01.333 --> 00:15:10.828
That's where democratic leadership style is going to be best suited, is when we need to create unity and consensus amongst our team members.

00:15:11.551 --> 00:15:15.889
So, yeah, so Nelson Mandela is a great example of that.

00:15:15.889 --> 00:15:21.225
I'll tell you what, though just even in this moment, I was thinking about some other examples of that.

00:15:21.225 --> 00:15:27.328
I think Martin Luther King Jr is an example of that right, listen.

00:15:27.328 --> 00:15:37.067
And I also think, even more recently, the Black Lives Matter movement is an interesting example of that Right.

00:15:37.067 --> 00:15:48.941
All of these movements are responding to oppressive action and they're responding to forms of leadership that dismiss the voices of other people.

00:15:48.941 --> 00:16:02.427
And so, you know, with Nelson Mandela, he had to bring together Black and white people in a time where Black people's voices were just completely shut out.

00:16:02.427 --> 00:16:05.673
Right, and and, and it's just like you know.

00:16:05.673 --> 00:16:08.985
And so he was the first democratically elected official.

00:16:09.005 --> 00:16:19.192
That's a huge deal, um, and even though the majority of South Africa is black and that like, so you had that, you had, he had that you.

00:16:19.192 --> 00:16:23.248
But you can't ignore the other parts of the population.

00:16:23.248 --> 00:16:25.011
You had to be able to bring them together.

00:16:25.011 --> 00:16:30.741
You have to be able to build consensus.

00:16:30.741 --> 00:16:33.346
You have to be able to bring multiple voices to the table and help them to talk to each other.

00:16:33.346 --> 00:16:42.773
Right, a lot of mediation, a lot of consultation, a lot of collaboration all these things have to happen, and that's an example of how he did that.

00:16:42.773 --> 00:16:44.726
I think Martin Luther King Jr did that as well.

00:16:44.726 --> 00:16:45.629
It's really interesting.

00:16:45.629 --> 00:16:47.177
He was actually.

00:16:47.177 --> 00:16:52.649
He was kind of more appointed than elected, but he was.

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He was picked by a group of people who who said hey, we need you to be our voice.

00:16:58.989 --> 00:17:02.804
But even though he was the voice, he was not the only leader in the movement.

00:17:03.287 --> 00:17:04.631
And that's one thing that we have to.

00:17:04.631 --> 00:17:07.811
I think unlearn about movements is movements don't have one leader.

00:17:07.811 --> 00:17:11.363
You, you have even Nelson Mandela had multiple leaders.

00:17:11.363 --> 00:17:13.807
Now, I'm not as familiar with the South African apartheid.

00:17:13.807 --> 00:17:15.211
You know anti-apartheid movement.

00:17:15.211 --> 00:17:21.094
I'm not, I'm not as familiar with that, so I can't speak to the leaders, um, that were involved in that.

00:17:21.114 --> 00:17:26.904
But I know, because democratic leadership, um, it, it, it.

00:17:26.904 --> 00:17:34.055
The one of the tenets of it is you share leadership, you're not just, not just pointed to one person.

00:17:34.055 --> 00:17:50.451
And so, with, even with Nelson Mandela, there were multiple leaders that he was having to cultivate and he was having to work with with Black Lives Matter, right, you, that one of the things that they, they, they really kind of hung their hat on was decentralized leadership.

00:17:50.451 --> 00:17:54.986
In other words, you can't look at a single person and call them the leader it's.

00:17:54.986 --> 00:17:58.156
It is a very democratic kind of movement.

00:17:58.156 --> 00:18:28.912
It is something where multiple voices are being heard and multiple people are making decisions, and this and this is this is it takes a very special type of, it's a very special type of style, because you have to have the confidence that leaders have, but also the humility to allow other people to lead, and that can be a really hard mix, and so I think that it's commendable for people who have that natural style of like.

00:18:28.912 --> 00:18:30.835
I know how to build consensus.

00:18:30.835 --> 00:18:34.789
I know how to empower other people and.

00:18:34.851 --> 00:18:46.202
I know how to release and share power Right Listen that's huge and I think I think it's something that has to be recognized.

00:18:46.202 --> 00:18:52.353
The power of it has to be recognized by other leadership styles.

00:18:52.353 --> 00:18:58.969
That's right, you know, because I think authoritarians kind of scoff at it a little bit, you know I.

00:18:58.969 --> 00:19:08.863
You know I'm getting a PhD in educational leadership, so we have a lot of conversations about how people learn what our teaching styles are.

00:19:08.863 --> 00:19:21.472
And you know, it is like it is so interesting the conversations between the people who are like no, when I get, excuse me, when I get in the classroom I'm the authority and.

00:19:21.712 --> 00:19:35.153
I am giving out the knowledge and they need to receive, versus people who are like no, I'm building a community where we're learning together and we are, you know, and anybody can contribute.

00:19:35.153 --> 00:19:39.590
I'm facilitating versus instructing.

00:19:39.590 --> 00:19:42.731
That's two totally different skills.

00:19:42.731 --> 00:19:48.333
It's two totally different skill sets, but they can do the same job.

00:19:48.333 --> 00:20:03.509
Job, like, we can both go in a classroom, prepare a lesson plan and execute and teach material, but we're going to approach it very differently.

00:20:03.730 --> 00:20:12.170
What stresses me out, because I'm a person that really values harmony and community, it's the ENFPFPME.

00:20:12.170 --> 00:20:15.115
What Myers-Briggs personality type.

00:20:15.115 --> 00:20:16.884
You know we did a personality episode.

00:20:16.884 --> 00:20:17.224
Let me know.

00:20:17.224 --> 00:20:21.082
If you need some more information on that right there, okay, cause I'm happy to give it.

00:20:21.082 --> 00:20:23.445
But what, what?

00:20:23.767 --> 00:20:43.334
What bothers me is when we don't have a respect and a regard for what we do, naturally for the gift of it, you know, because somebody who is more, has more of an authoritarian outlook, may see democratic leadership style as weak.

00:20:43.334 --> 00:20:50.443
Yeah, like, you are giving away your power, yeah, right, and if things get away from you, how do you get it back?

00:20:50.443 --> 00:20:53.231
Yeah, which is, which is a challenge.

00:20:53.231 --> 00:21:14.836
It is, it is, which is a challenge, but it's also like but I'm also able, when using the style, to build community, to build contentment amongst my workers, and I build people who rise up to challenges yes Versus people who wait for me to come.

00:21:14.836 --> 00:21:33.752
And I'll also say this, and I think this is going to get into kind of one of our next points is that you have to be careful If you know that your natural inclination, because the point of this series is not to tell you which style you are so that you stay stuck.

00:21:34.295 --> 00:21:47.829
The point of this series is for you to identify your natural inclination, because I think one of the most important things that we can know as middle adults is what is my preset mode?

00:21:47.829 --> 00:21:56.232
Because when it's time for me to do something different, I have to be able to recognize what is the pattern of what I've already been doing?

00:21:56.232 --> 00:21:56.854
That's right.

00:21:56.854 --> 00:22:01.551
What have I already been consistent in?

00:22:01.551 --> 00:22:03.224
What am I already employing?

00:22:03.224 --> 00:22:12.193
What skill sets, what parts of myself, my identity, my gifts, my talents, my skills do I just naturally pull on?

00:22:12.193 --> 00:22:16.105
Because what you naturally do will not work in every situation.

00:22:16.866 --> 00:22:18.590
Yes, and that's that's yes.

00:22:18.590 --> 00:22:20.662
That is something that is really important to unlearn.

00:22:20.662 --> 00:22:28.101
I would say that democratic leadership is probably a preset of mine.

00:22:28.101 --> 00:22:34.041
I won't say it's my only one, I think I have a couple, but it's definitely a preset and that is something I've had.

00:22:34.041 --> 00:22:40.433
I have had to unlearn where it belongs, where democratic leadership belongs.

00:22:40.433 --> 00:22:50.343
For those of you that find yourself you have that preset, Let me kind of help you with a little bit of experience.

00:22:50.343 --> 00:22:55.740
I've had, like as far as when it's appropriate right.

00:22:55.922 --> 00:23:01.142
There are certain things that need to be in place in order for effective democratic leadership to happen.

00:23:01.142 --> 00:23:12.648
Quinta's already spoken to one right Some level of experience with the people that you're trying to lead with, because it's really what it's about, right, Democratic leadership is a leading with kind of experience.

00:23:12.648 --> 00:23:17.417
You are very clear that you're not the only person that's going to make decisions.

00:23:17.417 --> 00:23:19.324
You want other people to make decisions.

00:23:19.324 --> 00:23:23.226
So that's the first thing you need to have people that are around you with the level of experience.

00:23:23.226 --> 00:23:31.950
If you are around a lot of entry level or junior level people, that may not be the right style to lead into and you might have to pivot to something different.

00:23:31.950 --> 00:23:35.844
The other thing is that it's important.

00:23:35.864 --> 00:23:42.406
That I have learned very much in my leadership is that democratic leadership requires an enormous amount of preparation.

00:23:42.406 --> 00:23:49.226
You have to prepare the people that you're looking for input from with information.

00:23:49.226 --> 00:23:51.611
You have to prepare them with vision.

00:23:51.611 --> 00:23:53.574
You have to prepare them with education.

00:23:53.574 --> 00:23:57.647
You have to prepare them with historical info.

00:23:57.647 --> 00:23:59.573
They need to understand context.

00:23:59.573 --> 00:24:04.449
You have to give them what they need to make sound decisions.

00:24:04.449 --> 00:24:22.007
If you're not doing that and I have learned this the hard way, y'all for real um, I have, I have, I have had seasoned people on my team that could have had, we could have had a better democratic leadership system if I give them more information.

00:24:22.007 --> 00:24:23.150
I was not.

00:24:23.510 --> 00:24:38.290
I was not seasoned enough as a leader to understand how much information they needed I was asking them for things they couldn't give me, not because they they didn't have the experience, because they didn't have the experience, because they didn't have the information, they didn't have the context, and the reason they didn't is because I was moving too fast to prepare.

00:24:38.290 --> 00:24:44.028
That was my issue as a leader who wants that input.

00:24:44.028 --> 00:24:45.592
You got to slow down.

00:24:45.592 --> 00:24:57.025
You got to slow down enough for the people to catch up to your knowledge, catch up to your context and give them time to give you what you're asking for, right.

00:24:57.025 --> 00:25:05.146
And so I had to unlearn that, and it took me a few years to do that, and so you can't empower people you don't equip.

00:25:05.688 --> 00:25:09.213
You absolutely cannot and that sounds so obvious.

00:25:09.213 --> 00:25:15.105
But I'm telling you, at least for me in the moment, because when you going, I mean what I'm going like.

00:25:15.105 --> 00:25:19.722
I'm like, okay, we're doing this, this, this, this and this, and I'm a leader that I value growth.

00:25:19.722 --> 00:25:22.008
That's one of my value traits.

00:25:22.008 --> 00:25:23.270
I, that's who I am.

00:25:23.270 --> 00:25:34.354
I always want to keep going, go further, go higher, all this stuff, and so and I'm pretty fast in my movement, I personally catch on to things really quickly, and so and I'm pretty fast in my movement, I personally catch on to things really quickly.

00:25:34.354 --> 00:25:37.137
And so when I'm ready to go, I'll go.

00:25:37.137 --> 00:25:42.446
But then when you become a leader and other people are looking to you, you can't just go like that.

00:25:42.446 --> 00:25:53.567
And if you want to have, if you want to exist in this leadership style, then you have to slow down enough to prepare your team to move at your pace.

00:25:53.567 --> 00:26:02.152
If you don't do that, but then ask them to be decision makers, they will not feel confident in doing that role.

00:26:02.653 --> 00:26:04.403
And then there's going to begin to.

00:26:04.403 --> 00:26:08.814
They will begin to uh, to, to hold that against you.

00:26:08.814 --> 00:26:09.435
They will.

00:26:10.459 --> 00:26:11.221
I have been there.

00:26:11.221 --> 00:26:19.029
I have been there and what's interesting is this is the crazy part, right, I remember the very first team I hired.

00:26:19.029 --> 00:26:24.369
Like, I hired this team to work with me and I knew I was like man, this team, they highly skilled, they ready.

00:26:24.369 --> 00:26:29.092
I'm hiring for things that I know they can do, but, like you said, queda, I want them to move up.

00:26:29.092 --> 00:26:31.005
Like I want to be able to give them more eventually.

00:26:31.065 --> 00:26:38.823
Right, you know what they told me at the end of maybe about a year, maybe a year and a half, and I asked them for feedback on my leadership.

00:26:38.823 --> 00:26:39.104
You know what?

00:26:39.104 --> 00:26:43.104
The number one thing that most of them told me was what you don't trust us.

00:26:43.104 --> 00:26:48.732
Whoa, they said you're like, you don't trust us.

00:26:48.732 --> 00:26:49.615
I don't feel trusted.

00:26:49.615 --> 00:26:50.801
I was like what are you talking about?

00:26:50.801 --> 00:26:53.846
I'm sitting here like I want you to do stuff.

00:26:53.846 --> 00:27:08.491
Here was the problem In my rush to be democratic, I didn't prepare them, which meant that I was judging them against a standard that they could meet and then, when they didn't meet it, I held it against them.

00:27:09.480 --> 00:27:10.000
Wow.

00:27:10.883 --> 00:27:16.387
And I said you know, and now, now I'm, now I'm showing up more often, now I'm asking more questions, x, Y, z.

00:27:16.387 --> 00:27:20.303
But if I wouldn't have to do that, if they had been properly prepared to do what I asked them to do?

00:27:22.027 --> 00:27:32.315
it took me three years to figure that out and I and quite frankly, I think I had the transition in my teams made a it made, made it.

00:27:32.315 --> 00:27:32.935
That that was.

00:27:32.935 --> 00:27:34.619
That was me as a learning leader.

00:27:34.619 --> 00:27:42.943
I I had, I had to learn it and I had to learn the hard way and I learned it and it was like yo, like I have to slow down.

00:27:42.943 --> 00:27:47.702
Don't assume just because they're skilled that they're ready to give you input.

00:27:47.702 --> 00:27:52.625
They have to have the right information, they have to, rather, have the right context and they need it from you, right?

00:27:52.625 --> 00:27:53.588
Um, and I?

00:27:53.588 --> 00:27:59.125
I held it against them that they weren't giving me what I needed, but I didn't give them what they needed to give me what I need.

00:27:59.125 --> 00:28:00.710
Yeah, that's on me.

00:28:01.792 --> 00:28:03.678
No that you know.

00:28:03.678 --> 00:28:07.230
A couple of thoughts came to mind while you were talking One.

00:28:07.230 --> 00:28:18.145
I think a mistake that a lot of democratic leaders can make is this idea that because I did it nicely, or because I did it with you in mind.

00:28:18.185 --> 00:28:21.652
I did it, I did it correctly, absolutely.

00:28:21.652 --> 00:28:50.568
I think a lot of this comes because I feel like a lot of millennials, especially us elder millennial, middle adults, uh, friends, I really think that we, that we really go hard with this democratic leadership, we are like listen, you will have a voice, you will feel included and empowered, and so we go in and we want everyone to feel good.

00:28:50.909 --> 00:29:03.875
Yeah, and I think democratic leadership, a place that we can falter in, is that we're constantly checking in to see if people are happy or to see if people are.

00:29:03.875 --> 00:29:06.385
We don't want anyone to feel discontent.

00:29:06.881 --> 00:29:12.931
We don't want anyone to feel like we've lorded over you, or that we, da, da, da, da, da, like we, we, we genuinely want everyone like hey, do you feel like you've lorded over you?

00:29:12.931 --> 00:29:21.661
Or that we, da, da, da, da, da, like we, we, we genuinely want everyone like hey, do you feel like you're having a great experience here and and you can get so focused on that?

00:29:21.661 --> 00:29:23.064
Yeah, that you don't.

00:29:23.064 --> 00:29:27.633
You don't really lead people because you have a place, let's.

00:29:27.633 --> 00:29:28.280
Let's be honest.

00:29:28.280 --> 00:29:29.242
You have a place in your mind.

00:29:29.242 --> 00:29:32.361
You want the team to get to sure you have objectives, you have goals.

00:29:32.361 --> 00:29:33.002
You are a leader, right like you.

00:29:33.002 --> 00:29:34.449
You are the team to get to Sure you have objectives, you have goals.

00:29:34.449 --> 00:29:35.112
You are a leader, right Like you.

00:29:35.132 --> 00:29:38.483
You are still, you're democratic, but you're still a leader on the inside.

00:29:38.483 --> 00:29:42.012
You thinking, all right, I'm, I'm molding a team to do this, to get here.

00:29:42.012 --> 00:29:43.382
You know, this is what we need.

00:29:43.382 --> 00:29:45.744
These are the things we need to hit, the metrics we need to hit.

00:29:45.744 --> 00:29:47.866
You have all of that in the back of your mind.

00:29:47.866 --> 00:29:54.516
You have empowered them to have a voice, but you have not.

00:29:54.516 --> 00:30:23.634
And they're looking at you as an example of this leadership style, but you don't give any voice or any verbiage or any insight into how you became who you are Like you're not walking them through a process, and that, I think, is one of the biggest drawbacks of democratic leadership, is that we don't.

00:30:24.440 --> 00:30:25.321
You're so you're.

00:30:25.321 --> 00:30:33.630
You're telling people, hey, come to the table with what you got, but not, hey, I'm going to develop what you have.

00:30:33.630 --> 00:30:38.128
I'm going to, I'm going to help you to be better, I'm going to strengthen you.

00:30:38.128 --> 00:30:44.710
I can't allow you to have all the power, because there's something in you that we're still working through.

00:30:44.710 --> 00:30:48.761
Right, and I have to be able to navigate between.

00:30:49.282 --> 00:30:50.786
Everybody gets a voice.

00:30:50.786 --> 00:30:55.714
And also, okay, we need to strengthen these areas of the team.

00:30:55.714 --> 00:30:59.788
Right, we need more development here.

00:30:59.788 --> 00:31:02.575
We need more precision here.

00:31:02.575 --> 00:31:12.605
We need people who are more trained in these areas right, and if your mindset stays focused on I want everyone to feel like they're a part of it.

00:31:12.605 --> 00:31:13.425
I want everyone to feel like they have a voice.

00:31:13.425 --> 00:31:13.963
I want everyone to feel like they're a part of it.

00:31:13.963 --> 00:31:14.806
I want everyone to feel like they have a voice.

00:31:14.806 --> 00:31:22.046
I want everyone to feel like you know I'm using their ideas and and and making changes that they say needs to happen.

00:31:22.046 --> 00:31:34.714
I want, I want that, if you stay focused on that and not on the idea that I am supposed to coach these people as their leader, to become better at their jobs.

00:31:34.859 --> 00:31:35.622
That's right, that's it.

00:31:35.622 --> 00:31:36.904
You have to do that.

00:31:37.928 --> 00:31:46.440
You have to do that, golly you have to, and coaching sucks sometimes it does Sometimes you have to tell people things that are really hard for them to hear.

00:31:46.539 --> 00:31:48.804
It slows you down.

00:31:48.804 --> 00:32:10.982
If I could speak to leaders who have a level of ambition, and if any of y'all are out here and you, like me and you have an ambitious, a bit ambition about you, meaning you always are thinking about, you know, moving up into the right on the chart, right you are, like we, growing you know what?

00:32:11.523 --> 00:32:13.730
I'm saying you know what I'm saying Like that's your mindset.

00:32:13.730 --> 00:32:24.086
It's like I don't think in any other terms other than up and to the right which, by the way, that's a myth, I mean, it's not gonna happen, but that's your desire.

00:32:24.086 --> 00:32:27.063
It's like I just wanna keep moving forward and I wanna keep growing.

00:32:27.063 --> 00:32:28.005
I wanna keep going higher.

00:32:28.005 --> 00:32:29.306
That's me.

00:32:29.306 --> 00:32:33.411
I don't know how else to think Like I'm, like that's who I am.

00:32:34.451 --> 00:32:37.395
You likely have an issue with pace.

00:32:37.395 --> 00:33:06.145
You likely are moving faster than your team can handle, and what I need to caution you in is you need to slow down, because your team especially and this is something I had to unlearn y'all, especially a good team will be more frustrated if they don't, if they are not equipped than a than than they would.

00:33:06.145 --> 00:33:19.970
If they would be more frustrated If you, if they, if you required them to move too fast with being unequipped, then if you slow them down but work to equip them I have experienced that y'all.

00:33:19.970 --> 00:33:22.413
Don't make the mistake I have made.

00:33:22.413 --> 00:33:25.307
Do like you have to slow.

00:33:25.627 --> 00:33:26.490
They are not.

00:33:26.490 --> 00:33:35.242
They have a level of ambition too, but what you have to realize is that they aren't spending the kind of time with the things you're spending.

00:33:35.242 --> 00:33:45.451
So, as a leader, you're thinking about things in ways that they are not thinking just because of the position you, in the perspective you have, and so.

00:33:45.451 --> 00:34:02.503
But they are good and they want to be better, but they can't be better if you don't prepare them to be better, which means you have to slow down, you have to get out of your own way and you have to really humble yourself and bring yourself down.

00:34:02.503 --> 00:34:11.206
Stop worrying about how good you are, and I'm saying that because I've had to fight that in my own life, in my own leadership life.

00:34:11.206 --> 00:34:13.871
I'm good at this, I'm good at that, I'm good at this, I'm good at it.

00:34:13.871 --> 00:34:14.893
It doesn't matter who cares.

00:34:14.893 --> 00:34:15.474
Nobody cares.

00:34:15.474 --> 00:34:19.400
You're only as good as your team, right, you're?

00:34:19.420 --> 00:34:20.083
only as good as your team.

00:34:21.340 --> 00:34:23.862
And I had to learn that when you become a leader, you're only as good as your team.

00:34:23.862 --> 00:34:29.987
You're only as good as the coach.

00:34:29.987 --> 00:34:30.909
Two different things.

00:34:30.909 --> 00:34:33.271
Stop trying to be the star player.

00:34:33.271 --> 00:34:35.432
You need to be the coach.

00:34:35.432 --> 00:34:40.277
And a coach instructs, a coach teaches, a coach educates.

00:34:40.277 --> 00:34:50.525
And that's what's needed for healthy, democratic leadership.

00:34:50.525 --> 00:34:54.697
If you want your point guard to be able to call plays, you better educate your point guard on how to read a court.

00:34:54.717 --> 00:34:55.719
Yeah, right, you know what I'm saying.

00:34:56.181 --> 00:34:57.246
That is necessary.

00:34:57.246 --> 00:35:00.349
You don't be mad at the point guard because he ain't calling the right plays.

00:35:00.349 --> 00:35:02.728
You ain't spent enough time with him to figure out what plays to call.

00:35:03.139 --> 00:35:04.606
Listen that part.

00:35:04.606 --> 00:35:29.565
And I also think one of the other pitfalls that those of us with Democratic leadership have to learn is that because a lot of times you know it's like with democratic leadership everybody has their voice, everybody has their part and you let them go do their thing kind of independently and you're not paying enough attention man, look, come on, you're not paying enough attention.

00:35:29.806 --> 00:35:43.384
And let me tell you something, jesus tell us somebody tell them as somebody who has gotten thrown off because I wasn't paying attention and they was going back and forth behind the back.

00:35:43.384 --> 00:36:06.063
Come on talking to other people, talk to right, because I was like man, my team, good, you know, I'm saying they got it, you know they strong, and you you're missing stuff because you are quote-unquote overly trusting and when I say that I mean you are, you're actually kind of dismissive.

00:36:06.063 --> 00:36:13.469
Yes, like you're like oh yeah, they got it, they're good, they're great, they don't need anything and then you have.

00:36:13.800 --> 00:36:22.648
what will happen is that you have people who are growing more and more disgruntled, right and, and they may feel like you're feeling like man.

00:36:22.648 --> 00:36:40.871
I have created such an awesome work environment where everyone feels empowered and everyone feels like, but on the inside they're like she's overworking me, she expects too much of me and does not help with what I'm doing.

00:36:40.871 --> 00:36:41.592
That's right.

00:36:41.592 --> 00:36:48.802
And in the meantime, you're like hey, we all help each other, but they, you, you have to be, you have to take a step back.

00:36:48.802 --> 00:36:50.706
It doesn't matter what your leadership style is.

00:36:50.706 --> 00:36:57.378
You have to take a step back and say, okay, maybe the way I'm seeing things is not the way my team is seeing.

00:36:57.378 --> 00:37:08.710
Oh God, maybe my intentions and my desires and the objectives and goals that I had in mind is not what they are reading from my leadership style.

00:37:08.730 --> 00:37:09.150
That's it.

00:37:09.150 --> 00:37:09.771
That's it.

00:37:09.771 --> 00:37:18.536
And you have to be real and sometimes you can do that by surveying your team and then sometimes you can just reflect Sometimes.

00:37:18.536 --> 00:37:24.751
Sometimes you need to be paying attention in them little one-on-one meetings or them little staff meetings.

00:37:24.751 --> 00:37:25.940
You need to.

00:37:25.940 --> 00:37:30.269
It is it is the job of every leader to be discerning.

00:37:30.269 --> 00:37:34.079
You don't get to sit there and be unaware, that's right.

00:37:34.079 --> 00:37:37.505
You don't get to sit there and be like I never knew.

00:37:37.686 --> 00:37:38.909
Baby you the leader.

00:37:39.230 --> 00:37:40.572
You know what I'm saying.

00:37:40.572 --> 00:37:45.990
It is your job that, if you don't know, to find out, to find out.

00:37:45.990 --> 00:37:46.751
That's right.

00:37:46.751 --> 00:37:53.311
If you don't know what the strengths and weaknesses of your team members are, it's your job to find out.

00:37:53.311 --> 00:38:03.394
So if you got to give them one of them personality assessments that we went over in one of them seasons back then hit us up.

00:38:03.394 --> 00:38:13.568
I'm happy to walk you through some assessments that you can do with your team to learn more about who you have and also what you're looking at as a.

00:38:13.568 --> 00:38:14.911
You know we're talking about.

00:38:14.911 --> 00:38:26.568
I think we were talking about in the context of other leaders looking at you and saying you know, like if they have an authoritarian style and you have a democratic style and they saying you weak baby, it could be your team members.

00:38:26.869 --> 00:38:29.079
That's right, it could be your team members.

00:38:29.079 --> 00:38:31.782
It likely will be your team members, yeah.

00:38:32.222 --> 00:38:39.789
Your team members looking at you like so you don't know how to you know, and that matter of fact, that happened to me.

00:38:39.789 --> 00:38:46.094
That definitely happened to me, because I was all like, hey, we all do this as a group.

00:38:46.094 --> 00:38:48.856
Okay, guys, what are your ideas, what are your thoughts?

00:38:48.856 --> 00:38:52.262
Okay, yeah, let's do this, let's move forward.

00:38:52.262 --> 00:39:03.655
And then it was said about me she don't know what she doing because in their minds and their little, okay, in their minds Amen.

00:39:03.835 --> 00:39:04.376
Amen.

00:39:04.655 --> 00:39:06.842
Amen, amen, hallelujah Uh.

00:39:06.842 --> 00:39:07.664
We thank the Lord.

00:39:07.684 --> 00:39:08.969
Yes, we do, yes, we do.

00:39:09.800 --> 00:39:10.920
I ain't even in that job, no more.

00:39:10.920 --> 00:39:17.643
But anyways, in their minds they said oh, she got to ask us because she don't know how to do it.

00:39:17.643 --> 00:39:23.646
No, baby, I'm asking you so that you can be empowered to grow to know able to do it.

00:39:23.646 --> 00:39:27.306
But I look back now and I'm like I took a lot of offense to that.

00:39:27.306 --> 00:39:29.628
But when I look from their perspective, they didn.

00:39:29.628 --> 00:39:56.224
My leadership style, this is how I move, these are my goals.

00:39:56.224 --> 00:40:02.141
I don't have a democratic style because I'm sitting back here trying to figure out the job.

00:40:02.141 --> 00:40:15.101
I have a democratic style because I want you guys to have the insight and wisdom of what goes into becoming the next level, the you know what I'm saying the next level, the next person.

00:40:15.101 --> 00:40:21.003
And a lot of people that I led and mentored and poured into got that, but there were a few who didn't.

00:40:21.625 --> 00:40:23.931
And yeah, and that's okay, they got it after I left, though.

00:40:24.320 --> 00:40:26.005
But there were a few.

00:40:26.005 --> 00:40:27.650
Yeah, yeah, you get it, Cause.

00:40:27.650 --> 00:40:30.702
It's like I love that.

00:40:30.702 --> 00:40:39.869
You said that they don't, that't you know, but that it shows you if your team is responding to you in a way that's like, why is she asking me for all of this?

00:40:39.869 --> 00:40:46.226
It shows you that the mindset of your team is not ready for democratic leadership, Like they aren't there.

00:40:46.226 --> 00:41:06.226
So it's possible, for a season, you might need to pivot into a different leadership style, which we will talk about in further episodes, but there might be a different leadership style that you might need to do in that moment.

00:41:06.226 --> 00:41:08.528
Let's think about it like this we live in a democratic republic.

00:41:08.528 --> 00:41:11.755
We all have a vote Now.

00:41:11.755 --> 00:41:16.313
We vote for representatives who then make laws, Got it, but we vote right.

00:41:17.534 --> 00:41:18.898
One of the most frustrating things.

00:41:18.898 --> 00:41:33.655
If you've ever been involved in any kind of voter education or voter recruitment or voter engagement things I've done a few of those you are it is shocking Sometimes.

00:41:33.655 --> 00:41:37.903
It is shocking as to how ignorant we are as voters.

00:41:37.903 --> 00:41:40.434
But yet we have the.

00:41:40.434 --> 00:41:49.777
We have the power to elect people to make decisions for our day-to-day lives and so but?

00:41:49.777 --> 00:41:54.001
But when you're once you've experienced that to some degree, the thing that you really want is like yo, like I want voters to.

00:41:54.001 --> 00:41:59.436
Once you've experienced that to some degree, the thing that you really want is like yo, like I want voters to understand, I want people to be educated.

00:41:59.436 --> 00:42:04.610
I don't want voters who just know a name and they're voting for that same name over and over.

00:42:04.610 --> 00:42:15.684
That's how you get people that have been elected for 20 years and aren't doing anything, Because that's when you look at the ballot, that's what you, that you know that name, or that's how you see the signs.

00:42:15.684 --> 00:42:21.655
They have all these signs out, they have enough money to out-sign other people, and that's how they get elected.

00:42:21.655 --> 00:42:24.251
But you don't really know, you don't have input in.

00:42:40.909 --> 00:42:57.213
And so I think the thing to remember is to the level that we are in our general society can be frustrated by uneducated voters is to the same level as your team is frustrated because they are not educated to make decisions.

00:42:57.213 --> 00:43:05.577
You cannot expect them to make decisions if you have not properly educated them, and that's not fair.

00:43:05.577 --> 00:43:13.463
It's not fair to them, and so you have to be able to, like Queda was saying earlier, the discernment of a team, discernment of a leader.

00:43:13.463 --> 00:43:15.733
Queda was saying earlier, the discernment of a team, discernment of a leader.

00:43:15.733 --> 00:43:23.141
I mean one of it is to understand where is my team, when are the people that are following my direction, when are they in their journey?

00:43:23.141 --> 00:43:25.626
Right, and I have to be able to meet them where they are.

00:43:25.626 --> 00:43:32.969
And there are some people as much as you might want them, as much as you might want to have a democratic way of leading, they just aren't ready for it.

00:43:33.090 --> 00:43:34.496
They don't have enough education.

00:43:34.496 --> 00:43:38.840
I had to find me a little authoritarianism.

00:43:38.840 --> 00:43:42.764
I'm serious, I had to be like hey, all right, listen, look here.

00:43:44.856 --> 00:43:46.161
Some things don't need consensus.

00:43:46.161 --> 00:43:58.192
I think that's and that's one of the beautiful things about democratic leadership, but one of the things if you go back, you know, 30 minutes ago we were kind of talking about the definition it was talking about.

00:43:58.192 --> 00:44:04.364
One of the ways to adapt that leadership style is to understand consensus situations.

00:44:04.364 --> 00:44:08.039
Every situation doesn't require a consensus.

00:44:08.039 --> 00:44:10.177
Every situation doesn't need a vote.

00:44:10.177 --> 00:44:16.690
Some things you just need to make a decision on doesn't need a vote.

00:44:16.690 --> 00:44:17.713
Some things you just need to make a decision on.

00:44:17.713 --> 00:44:30.050
And the shadow side of democratic leadership is I think you're absolutely right, you said it earlier you want to be light, you want people to feel good, right, and you want them to feel like they have a voice and all this stuff.

00:44:30.791 --> 00:44:32.715
I have fallen into that trap, boy.

00:44:32.715 --> 00:44:33.978
I thought people were.

00:44:33.978 --> 00:44:46.782
I had, I believe this lie that if I didn't give people that kind of autonomy early, that they would want to leave because they felt babied or they felt, um, you know, not trusted or whatever.

00:44:46.782 --> 00:44:53.782
But what I had to learn was, if you hire good people, they want to earn it.

00:44:53.782 --> 00:44:58.090
Yeah, they want to earn it.

00:44:58.090 --> 00:45:08.871
They don't expect to get it immediately, because I've also had the opposite, where there are people that expect it with having put in nothing, and that's a red flag Like hold on right, you haven't earned the right to be heard yet.

00:45:08.871 --> 00:45:20.096
You ain't even been here for two days, so so you don't know enough and you don't know and you are under the delusion that you do, and that's a red flag.

00:45:20.096 --> 00:45:27.096
But for good people they are waiting right To make decisions until they know enough.

00:45:27.556 --> 00:45:29.380
My board I have a board right.

00:45:29.380 --> 00:45:31.731
Um nonprofits have board members.

00:45:31.731 --> 00:45:32.351
I have a board.

00:45:32.351 --> 00:45:38.255
Um would say about four or five of those board members are fairly new to the organization.

00:45:38.255 --> 00:45:41.518
I just had a board conversation recently.

00:45:41.518 --> 00:45:51.784
I do one-on-ones with the board and I was talking to a board member recently and she said I want to find a place where I can really be relevant.

00:45:51.784 --> 00:45:56.128
And I told her I was like I'm so glad you're saying this is the perfect time to have this conversation.

00:45:56.128 --> 00:45:57.092
I didn't want to put so.

00:45:57.092 --> 00:46:20.327
I didn't want to like get so excited to be like hey, I want you to come and do this like day one, like you didn't know the organization, like and and so I've learned to kind of let even highly skilled people sit for a minute, like just sit and just you know, just just learn, even though I know that they could probably do more and they know they could, but I'm not going to force it because you need to sit for a minute.

00:46:20.407 --> 00:46:30.376
And that was she, and she was so, and I love the conversation we had because she was so ready to move, because she was like I'm eager now because I've learned and I've seen.

00:46:30.376 --> 00:46:31.057
You know what I'm saying.

00:46:31.579 --> 00:46:44.425
Listen, cause I gotta, I gotta, I gotta pull that that tab right there, because I think, as leaders, you gotta learn to sit for a little bit.

00:46:44.425 --> 00:47:03.047
You know, I think we, if you and I say this honestly and truthfully, because I just got out of a season of sitting and it was glorious and it was necessary, but it was also hard, because the whole time I was just like what's my purpose?

00:47:03.427 --> 00:47:06.175
yeah, yeah, yeah yeah aimless.

00:47:06.317 --> 00:47:06.516
Like.

00:47:06.516 --> 00:47:07.681
What am I supposed to be doing?

00:47:07.681 --> 00:47:10.469
Rest, you're supposed to be resting.

00:47:10.469 --> 00:47:12.157
Yeah, you, you're supposed to be focused on yourself right now.

00:47:12.157 --> 00:47:12.780
You're supposed to be resting.

00:47:12.780 --> 00:47:14.429
Yep, you're supposed to be focused on yourself right now.

00:47:14.429 --> 00:47:21.643
You're supposed to be focused on figuring out who you are in this moment, in this season.

00:47:21.643 --> 00:47:25.820
Right, so that you can be your best self for the next busy season.

00:47:26.411 --> 00:47:28.438
Every season can't be a busy one, y'all.

00:47:28.438 --> 00:47:32.940
Every season can't be grinding and hustling and getting to it.

00:47:32.940 --> 00:47:36.440
Some seasons are just for rest.

00:47:36.440 --> 00:47:41.882
Yeah, and rest looks different, like it's not just rest is not.

00:47:41.882 --> 00:47:42.989
You know what I'm saying.

00:47:42.989 --> 00:47:44.617
I just sit around in the bed all day.

00:47:44.617 --> 00:47:46.092
Rest is.

00:47:46.092 --> 00:47:50.882
I bought an adult coloring book and I allow my mind to play again.

00:47:50.882 --> 00:47:56.971
You know, like whatever, whatever that is for you, like, we need to figure that out.

00:47:56.971 --> 00:48:19.213
Um, because I think, if we don't, you will find yourself in your leadership, looking to be taken care of, and a lot of us in these democratic leadership positions, we want to feel like and appreciate it, and we want to feel like we're the leader that you never thought you could have.

00:48:19.775 --> 00:48:25.956
And that you know what I'm saying, Like on your next job interview, I want you to be like, oh, I really didn't want to leave.

00:48:25.956 --> 00:48:30.153
You know, it was so hard because my leader was so amazing.

00:48:30.153 --> 00:48:35.246
You know, like we want that, right, but you are pulling from the team.

00:48:35.246 --> 00:48:48.380
You are, you are pulling, uh, you are pulling for the team to invest in you what you need to be investing in yourself, and you need to find ways to do that.

00:48:48.681 --> 00:49:07.588
Yeah, because let me tell you something Leadership is not about being like ain't, ain't, ain't Lord, no, that ain't ain't Ain't no part of leadership and I think you know some some other things about democratic leadership is that it can be really innovative, because all the ideas can't come from me.

00:49:07.588 --> 00:49:08.230
That's right.

00:49:08.230 --> 00:49:12.494
You know all, all the direction and all the we should do this and we should do that.

00:49:12.494 --> 00:49:19.300
It can't come from me, and I need to be able to share credit and I need to be able to.

00:49:19.300 --> 00:49:34.782
I have to get to a point, and this is what can get missed in democratic leadership is that it is not just about the ideas flowing and the innovation growing right when they throw out those ideas.

00:49:34.782 --> 00:49:36.027
That is not a okay, go do that moment.

00:49:36.027 --> 00:49:37.550
That is a okay.

00:49:37.690 --> 00:49:46.775
I'm going to develop you to be able to do that idea right, because a lot of times people are throwing out ideas that are bigger than them.

00:49:46.775 --> 00:49:49.461
They are bigger than the moment.

00:49:49.461 --> 00:49:53.115
Sometimes the ideas that they're throwing out are bigger than the organization.

00:49:53.115 --> 00:50:03.182
You again have to be a discerner and you have to that's your role as the leader to say that's a good idea, but not for right now.

00:50:03.182 --> 00:50:10.829
That's a good idea, but I'm going to put you and you together because y'all need to work on it together and then send back reports.

00:50:10.829 --> 00:50:33.237
You got to build strategies and structures and frameworks around these ideas and not just allow everything to be free flowing because, honestly and truly, they don't all the time know exactly what to do with the ideas that they're presenting 100%, and I think that's if there's nothing that you all take away from this.

00:50:33.257 --> 00:50:53.121
I think that, and the reason I think that's if there's nothing that you all take away from this, I think that, and the reason I think we are kind of speaking more to the at least I feel like we're speaking more to the sometimes problematic or just warning signs of democratic leadership is because that leadership style is so celebrated, especially nowadays.

00:50:53.121 --> 00:50:55.398
It's so put on a pedestal.

00:50:55.398 --> 00:50:58.438
I think it's very and there are upsides to it.

00:50:59.452 --> 00:51:10.219
I mean you do get to collaborate with your team and their voices are heard, and, honestly, you can't build a movement, you can't grow without voices that are outside of yours.

00:51:10.219 --> 00:51:11.322
It's not possible.

00:51:11.322 --> 00:51:12.858
Democratic leadership is essential for growth.

00:51:12.858 --> 00:51:21.202
It's essential for growth, it's essential for movement, and so, if that's where you are, you have to use it right.

00:51:21.202 --> 00:51:34.440
If you have people who are skilled and who are informed and who are experienced, this is the leadership style you want to use, and so that is very important.

00:51:34.440 --> 00:51:35.842
Again, they have to be prepared.

00:51:35.842 --> 00:51:58.239
You got to make sure that they have the tools that they need, resource them well, and then let them go Listen to what they're saying, because they have built up enough credibility in whatever they're doing to be able to speak to things, they understand things, in a way that would actually benefit and value the future of whatever you're doing.

00:51:58.239 --> 00:52:01.018
That is it's essential.

00:52:01.210 --> 00:52:19.054
You can't move, you can't grow without it, and so I think that it's a very celebrated style and, at the same time, the reality is, most leaders, most ambitious leaders, have not actually prepared their team for that, and that's why I think we're talking about it like this.

00:52:19.054 --> 00:52:33.201
We don't want to overly celebrate it when it isn't actually done in a healthy way, or it can actually be detrimental if you do this style with a team who's not ready for it.

00:52:33.201 --> 00:52:51.768
And in my case, I really believe that there was a lot of a democratic leadership tactics that I used that my team was not ready for, not because they weren't good enough, but because I didn't prepare them that's on me for as a leader and so don't like hear this and like, hey, we're I.

00:52:52.007 --> 00:52:55.679
I think democratic leadership, I think that is an ideal place to get for a leader.

00:52:55.679 --> 00:53:00.699
It's just not where most leaders are.

00:53:00.699 --> 00:53:03.003
If we're being honest, that's not really where you are.

00:53:03.003 --> 00:53:16.543
And so take evaluation that's not the word Take inventory of where you are and recognize like I want to be here, here's what I.

00:53:16.543 --> 00:53:21.559
Work your way backwards, reverse, engineer and say what do I need to do to get there?

00:53:21.559 --> 00:53:33.398
Don't jump there because you like your team, because they like you not enough, and that I think that has been my main point is that you can not.

00:53:33.418 --> 00:53:37.134
Oh, I want to, I want to be liked, I want to like people like I'm not.

00:53:37.134 --> 00:53:40.603
I'm not saying that that that shouldn't be a desire.

00:53:40.603 --> 00:53:42.996
I'm saying it shouldn't be the mission.

00:53:42.996 --> 00:53:44.139
Yeah, that's it.

00:53:44.139 --> 00:53:58.411
Oh, my gosh, it can be a byproduct, right, but it should not be the goal, right, right, the goal, right, right.

00:53:58.411 --> 00:53:59.054
And you have to build.

00:53:59.054 --> 00:54:00.940
You have to build a leadership that can house the mission of the team.

00:54:00.940 --> 00:54:15.800
And you have to identify and that's why we're doing this, the series is because you have to be able to identify the moment you're in and identify the tool that's going to get you to the next place you're trying to go.

00:54:15.800 --> 00:54:17.452
And I think it's also important.

00:54:17.833 --> 00:54:21.103
I don't, I would say I use democratic leadership.

00:54:21.103 --> 00:54:23.338
It's not my main style.

00:54:23.338 --> 00:54:28.612
Like you know, like this is, you know, I, I, I've been told y'all I'm transformational all day.

00:54:28.612 --> 00:54:34.300
Okay, but you know, but it is, it is, I think, even knowing your medley.

00:54:34.300 --> 00:54:41.510
But you know, but it is, it is, I think, even knowing your medley, you know, like what, what's, what's, what's natural in my toolbox?

00:54:41.510 --> 00:54:43.512
It doesn't.

00:54:43.512 --> 00:54:47.969
You know, this is not kind of like some of the other personality things that we've done, where you know like, oh yeah, my test results say, I'm this right.

00:54:47.969 --> 00:54:53.181
Like you can have a medley, you can have, you can have a little combination.

00:54:53.181 --> 00:54:57.833
That is that is you know, true to you.

00:54:57.833 --> 00:54:58.715
But you can have a little combination.

00:54:58.715 --> 00:54:59.498
That is that is you know, true to you.

00:54:59.498 --> 00:55:00.360
But you, you have to know how to pivot.

00:55:00.360 --> 00:55:09.858
You have to know and I think that that's that's what we're, uh, most pushing in this segment is, hey, knowing where you are, so you can know how to pivot.

00:55:12.822 --> 00:55:23.699
And I think, I think this is our pivot to the end.

00:55:23.739 --> 00:55:23.980
Listen.

00:55:23.980 --> 00:55:26.262
First of all, proud of us under an hour.

00:55:26.543 --> 00:55:30.208
Hey man, look at us, we ain't gonna hold you too long Producer.

00:55:30.208 --> 00:55:31.637
Joy is very proud.

00:55:31.960 --> 00:55:32.443
Listen.

00:55:32.443 --> 00:55:38.425
Producer Joy is so happy because this is her desire for us on every episode.

00:55:38.425 --> 00:55:42.704
Every episode, yes, and we be ignoring her hour-end check marks.

00:55:42.724 --> 00:55:43.387
We sure do.

00:55:43.387 --> 00:55:44.070
We ignore you.

00:55:44.190 --> 00:55:46.835
We be like nope, nope, I still got things to say.

00:55:46.835 --> 00:55:49.273
She be, so.

00:55:49.273 --> 00:55:50.056
Done with us, y'all.

00:55:50.056 --> 00:55:51.793
But anywho, listen.

00:55:51.793 --> 00:56:01.565
If you like this conversation, if you like what we're talking about here in these unlearning streets, please like, share and subscribe.

00:56:01.565 --> 00:56:05.112
Yeah, tell a friend and tell a friend engage with us in the comments.

00:56:05.112 --> 00:56:08.699
Um, we are, you know, we.

00:56:08.699 --> 00:56:12.692
We do this because we love y'all and we love leadership.

00:56:12.692 --> 00:56:14.739
We love and we love building other people.

00:56:14.739 --> 00:56:24.135
You know, we're not trying to gain anything else out of this, so please just support us, um, so that we can continue to give y'all this good content.

00:56:24.135 --> 00:56:26.179
Absolutely, y'all, absolutely.

00:56:26.219 --> 00:56:26.599
All right.

00:56:26.599 --> 00:56:44.860
So now we are going to continue to unlearn as leaders together so that we can experience just a little bit more freedom, my Lord, and until then, we're going to say bye, peace.

00:56:44.860 --> 00:56:53.103
Thank you once again for listening to the Unlearned Podcast.

00:56:53.103 --> 00:56:57.282
We would love to hear your comments and your feedback about the episode.

00:56:57.282 --> 00:57:04.023
Feel free to follow us on Facebook and Instagram and to let us know what you think.

00:57:04.023 --> 00:57:10.364
We're looking forward to the next time when we are able to unlearn together to move forward towards freedom.

00:57:10.364 --> 00:57:11.291
See you then.