Building Foundations in the Intermission

Welcome And Guest Introduction

SPEAKER_01 0:04

What's up, everybody? Welcome back to the Unlearned Podcast. This is your girl Jaquita, and we are back with the second act. This is the place where we reflect on where we've been so we can rewrite our next friends. I have a brother from another mother here today. Okay, listen, Dr. Emmanuel Chandler, okay, is one of my there are only a few guys that I refer to as a true brother. Okay. And Emmanuel, since my time at Furman, before he before he married my best friend, okay, before he went and had, you know, my nieces and my nephew. Okay, before he did all of that, Emmanuel has always been a true friend and a brother to me. I'm gonna read his official bio, but I needed y'all to know that I don't play about him, okay? This my brother for real, for real.

SPEAKER_02 0:56

Okay, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 0:58

We for real in this, okay? All right, so Dr. Emmanuel Chandler is an adolescent medicine physician who is an associate professor of pediatrics and division director at a major children's hospital in Ohio. He is a leader in adolescent health, a devoted husband to Janae, a proud father of three beautiful children, and a man of God. Hallelujah! Whose faith informs his commitment to serving young people, family, and communities. Friends, I introduce you all to my brother, Dr. Emmanuel Chandler.

SPEAKER_03 1:33

Thanks, Rakuita. I appreciate it. I'm excited to be here. You know, I'm a I'm a fan of the Unlearnt Podcast. I thoroughly enjoy it. I listen to it, if not every week, almost every week. I'm tuning in, I'm listening, I'm fans of you and uh and Ruth Abigail. So I'm glad to be here.

SPEAKER_01 1:52

Listen, y'all. When I say my brother is a fan, okay, he literally watches almost every episode. Like if I'm on the phone with Jaune, manually be like, oh, that was a good episode, y'all didn't I like what y'all did with that. And you know, and and to the point where when we're having our you know background conversations, we're like, huh, would Emmanuel like this? Like, how would he how would someone like Emmanuel like he kind of became the prototype because we know that he really is invested in it?

SPEAKER_03 2:21

And so I'm very invested. So I'm excited. I'm excited to be here.

SPEAKER_01 2:24

I'm it's only if only we can get Jay on board. I'm working on Jeanne.

SPEAKER_03 2:31

I'm trying. She goes in here and there, even though she's been a guest once or twice. I'm not, I can't remember, but once, maybe twice. Maybe twice. I know she's been sleeping on the podcast, but Slack.

SPEAKER_01 2:42

Slack. Jeanne is one of my best friends, have known known her since 2005, Furman Days. Um, and so it's it's been, you know, Emmanuel. I think your relationship, I've had a few relationships that I've gotten to see from like the very, very genesis of it, but really just watching you and Jaune, you know, which y'all will they, won't they season. Um, and then into like this flourishing, beautiful marriage with all these beautiful kids, you know, it's been really just a pleasure and a and a privilege to watch how God works when God builds kingdom marriages, you know. And even though mine is coming a little later in life, it's coming though, it's coming.

SPEAKER_03 3:25

That's the most important thing.

SPEAKER_01 3:27

Somebody's, you know, because every time you talk to uh save folk about marriage, they start saying, You're not supposed to do the finding, you're supposed to be found. And I was like, Well, I don't think he's good at finding. Okay, I I I think he would have lost his hide-and-seek game because uh brother man is out here struggling.

SPEAKER_03 3:46

I don't think he's struggling. I think, you know, you are, I think as women, you have to put yourself in a place to be found, which I think you are doing that. And so as you put yourself in that place to be found, he's gonna find you. I think he's just he's still using that map and trying to figure out where you're gonna be. We just need him, like you said, to get on board and get it together and use the map appropriately so he can find you quickly.

SPEAKER_01 4:11

Tell you what, next season, I'm gonna have my boot thing on the second act. Okay.

The Childhood Dream To Practice Medicine

SPEAKER_03 4:16

That's gonna be your second act.

SPEAKER_01 4:17

Listen, that's gonna be my second act. Listen, but we're not here to talk about meeting that. Listen, you know, I think it's always, you know, I don't know if I've ever told you this, Emmanuel, or if you've ever realized this. You actually have the dream job of mine when I was a kid. Like, if people asked me what I was gonna do when I grew up, I wanted to be a pediatrician.

SPEAKER_03 4:40

So, you know, I heard that on the previous episode that just aired. I'll be forgetting you watch all the episodes. I watched the episode. And I when I heard that, I was like, oh, I never knew that. I never knew you wanted to be a pediatrician.

SPEAKER_01 4:51

Yeah, no, from like literally like five years old to like end of 11th grade, I was like, I'm gonna, I was set. Anytime anyone asked me what I was gonna do or what I wanted to do, it was pediatrician. There was never a question in my mind, there was never a thought of maybe if and no, I was gonna be a doctor, right? And I think a lot of kids, you know, as they are kind of like just beginning to know what a career or what, you know, what you do, like a lot of us say, you know, doctor, fireman, policeman, right? Because those are the images that are given to us, right? I'm really interested. Were you always 100% set? I'm gonna be a doctor, or was there a different aspiration?

SPEAKER_03 5:36

I was 100% set that I was gonna be a doctor. Actually, this the story is at eight years old, I watched an episode on uh the TLC channel. I forgot what TLC stands for, but anyway, it was a show they were showing a open heart surgery. And I was watching it with one of my parents. I'm not sure if it was my mom or my dad, but I remember turning around to them and saying, this is what I want to do. I want to be a heart surgeon. And so from that day on, like I never shifted from wanting to be a doctor. Now, there were times where I thought, like, as I went through, you know, as I grew up and experienced different things, I thought maybe, oh, maybe I'll be an eye doctor or maybe I'll be a dentist. But it always was set in medicine. There was one point in college that I did consider being like maybe a professor or teaching. Um I really enjoy like student life, like kind of what kind of what you do.

SPEAKER_01 6:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 6:28

But um then I came back to I it was short-lived. I came back to that.

SPEAKER_01 6:33

You were like, I'm playing games. So I came back to the city. I signed me up for a biology class. I got I got out chat for a little bit. Put me in that biochemistry.

SPEAKER_03 6:42

Exactly. So I came back to being a doctor. So it's always been, ever since I was eight years old, I wanted to be a doctor. And then probably shortly thereafter, I realized I wanted to be a pediatrician, partially because I had a pediatrician who looked like me. Um I really learned probably around high school/slash college that I loved working with kids. And so I loved science, I love medicine. I was like, I definitely want to be a pediatrician. Of course, that did I consider other options when I was in medical school, but it always, I always thought I wanted to be a doctor, and my family was, and parents were really intentional in making sure that happened.

SPEAKER_01 7:18

Okay, because that I'm I'm I I I hear you say, because I know the moment you said I want to be a doctor. Y'all, I know his whole family. Okay, when I say his whole family, I know all his people. Right? When you said you wanted to be a doctor, I feel like you locked in, but I know your mama. I know, I know Karen Chandler. Hey, Miss Chandler, I know Karen Chandler was like, say less.

SPEAKER_03 7:41

Exactly. She was she was definitely like, say less. If you know my mom, hey mama, uh, because she's gonna be watching. She uh when you tell her you're gonna do something and you're serious about it, she also becomes serious about it. So she was locked in, and every opportunity that she had to make sure that this dream became a reality, uh, she she put me in those opportunities. Like for I remember, what is it, in high school, she signed me up for um, it was a summer program where I got the opportunity to work at one of the local hospitals and like learn about all the different specialties in medicine, where it was like physical therapy, it was surgeons, it was different people coming in to talk to about different opportunities. So she did that. Uh, first and foremost, my mom was a stickler about education. So the story. But most people who know me know this part of my life. But my God, today, this is my favorite story, y'all. My my mom did not play when it came down to school. She said, whether whether I wanted to be a doctor or not be a doctor, like you're gonna get an education because education is the key that's gonna unlock doors for you, in addition to the lore, of course. But Hallelujah. That was the second second was education. Um, and so when I got home, if I did not have homework, Webster was my best friend. So that means I'm talking about Webster's dictionary. Because if you did not have homework, I had to open up the dictionary. I had to at least read four different uh words and their meanings, and I had to tell my mom what I read and what the meanings of those words were. And um, so if I said, like, hey, I don't have any homework today, I want to go out and play, she'd say, Oh, no, no, no, no, you got homework. Go grab that dictionary. Uh, and tell me four words you've uh learned and tell me the meanings. And that, I mean, she did that, I don't know, for a long time until I got, you know, until I got into the later years where I always had homework. But that was that was key in helping me uh shape my discipline and like understanding like, hey, this is this is this is what it's gonna

Discipline Built At Home

SPEAKER_03 9:40

take for you to become what you're what you're saying you want to become, which is a physician.

SPEAKER_01 9:44

Now see, I love that. I um I spent a long time teaching and I uh used to teach, I teach, I used to teach college skills courses. And I would have students that would come in and tell me that they wanted to be a doctor, and I'd take them to the side and I'd be like, baby, you late to every class, you on to your homework in, um, and everywhere I see you moving slow, like you, you, you shuffling around like you ain't got nothing to do. I said, your your character is not matching up with what it is that you're what you're saying you want to do, because doctors have to be able to hold so much information, right? Like I remember praying over when Joy was in pharmacy school. I remember praying, like, Lord, increase the capacity of her brain because I learning every single medicine and every single drug and every single component of that and what it does and how it does that. Like that is so much information. And I also think the thing that I really want to talk to you about is so much pressure, right? The pressure to have the right answer, the pressure to know what to do, the pressure to make decisions that are not just concerning yourself, but like you are constantly telling people about their life. Um, and I'm wondering, and you're kind of giving me some hints of it now, because your mama had you reading that dictionary, which is like saying you don't get to do what everybody else does. You don't, you don't, you don't, you know, but you don't, it's not that you don't have the freedom to, you don't have the you don't have the space to, you don't have the capacity to do what they do if you really are serious about what you say you want to do. Yeah. Right? How did that growing up how did that create or shift the ways that you relate it with your peers?

SPEAKER_03 11:38

Ooh, that's a great question. Um I think it it helped me to realize, like you said, like I I wasn't going to be able to do everything that everybody else was doing if I wanted to attain this goal. Um I think also being growing up in so as you said, I'm a man of God and a man of faith. Hallelujah. Growing up in the church background that I have, my home church back in South Carolina, shout out to God Chosen Assembly Church and Apostles. I go there too. Um I think those teachings of frankly, of holiness and being set apart and being not part of the crowd and being a remnant, all those great things that we learned about in the scriptures help solidify and help me realize that it's okay not to not be part of the crowd and to to really think about like what do what has God called me to do and how do I need to orchestrate my life to do what he's called me to do? Because I mean, honestly, the medicine is a calling for me. It's not just a job, it's not just a career, it's my calling. And so I think all those things established me. But I think also there was things that happened to me when I was growing up. So I don't know, I don't know, everyone doesn't know this about me, of course. I don't think I've ever shared this with you, is that I was bullied a lot in my early years, like elementary school, middle school, and a lot of times it made me feel isolated. And I think in that isolation, sometimes I think that is, even though it was traumatic at times and I didn't like it. I wanted me to be have a lot of friends. I didn't understand why I was getting picked on and I was just happening to me. But I think sometimes that happens. Those experiences happen to us to, or happened to me. Let me say those experiences happened to me to kind of help me be okay and being in this situation or being by myself or being alone, um, even though it was traumatic. I didn't like it. Um, but I think sometimes that helped me be okay with, you know, as you said earlier, just being not part of the crowd and having to set myself aside or set myself apart to do things differently and uh and walk and kind of walk my own path that I was going down.

SPEAKER_01 13:52

Yeah. No, I'm really sorry that happened to you. And I think that, you know, I think a lot of people have, even even the people who appear to be kind of like on the top of the social chain, right? There was these feelings of feeling isolated from the crowd or feeling

Bullying Trauma And Identity

SPEAKER_01 14:10

like you didn't fit in. Um, and some of us uh were able to express that to others, and some of us had to internalize it. And I know that there's a lot of middle adults who are still living with that trauma of, you know, I nobody accepted me, nobody wanted me, nobody, nobody uh uh understood me, right? And and I and I think that that trauma is playing out in different ways for a lot of people. Um I'm wondering at what point in your life were you able to draw a line and separate yourself from that experience and to grow from it?

SPEAKER_03 14:50

I think it was later in high school, so like my junior, senior year. I think, you know, I think you know, teenage years is just a challenge. Troublesome, troublesome, right? Troublesome. You're going through this awkward stage, you're trying to find who you are, find your identity, find your purpose, all those things. Um, and so I think though, as I went through um my teenage years, I began to really find out who God made me to be and find my own identity. And I began to feel okay with being different and being set apart and being on this different kid. You know, my my all my family members, like my cousins and stuff, are excellent in athletics and sports and all that kind of stuff. That is not my ministry. I can run, you know, I can I did track and I was pretty good at it and all that good stuff, but that was not.

SPEAKER_01 15:45

But you ain't you ain't hit that football field.

SPEAKER_03 15:46

I didn't hit the football field. The basketball, the basketball courts with my family, like thrives, like true. And and your daughter now out there thrives, my dad, uncle, but that wasn't my ministry, and I had to be okay with accepting, like, okay, man, academics and being a nerd is your ministry. That's what you you're smart, you're you you're good at academics, but yeah, I had to accept that. And it was around like probably junior, senior year that I think part of this also had to do with my my family and my my parents and like just them instilling in me, like the things they instilled in me, like the character traits and all those things that helped me accept, like, hey, this is who you are. You cannot let people, what they say, what they think about you, determine who you are. And so that was around junior, senior year. I remember like junior when I was going to my senior year, I was like, you know what? I'm gonna be me. This is me. I'm gonna accept me for who I am. I'm a nerdy, smart black man, and I'm just gonna be who I am. And I think when I accepted that and accepted who God made me to be, it actually shifted like my my friend dynamics in high school, like seeing all my best years of of high school, like when it when it came down to socially, academically, all those things, because I think I accepted who God had made me to be.

SPEAKER_02 17:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:02

That's where that shift happened. And then, of course, you know, over time, I still had to deal with even now in my adulthood. Like when I see kids bullying other kids, that burns my buns.

SPEAKER_02 17:15

Your buns.

SPEAKER_03 17:18

I do not I I can't stand it because I experienced that. So I know what it feels to be on the other side. I like even with my own kids, like, you know, their brother and sister, I have three kids, you know, they're they're two of them are very close in age, and I sometimes I see that behavior, and I'm always like, no, what you're not gonna be is a bully. We're not gonna be a bully, we're not gonna have someone endure that. And so, but I also have to realize, like, to make sure I don't respond in a way out of like trauma from being bullied, but I'm able to like teach my kids um around like how this is this is why we're not gonna act that way, and this is what even I've even shared with my kids, this is what daddy experienced, this is why I don't want you to do that, because it can feel isolated, it can make people feel like they don't belong. Um, so all that to say, like, I think I'm still learning and unlearning some of the trauma and the behaviors and things that happened to me, but I think it was my senior year that I really accepted who God called me to be and that has allowed me to grow from that standpoint.

SPEAKER_01 18:18

Okay. I love about five different things you said, and then my mind was like pulling it, like, don't lose it, Queen, don't lose it, don't lose it. But I love that you were able, because a lot of people don't do it in high school. Okay. I didn't get there until college. In high school, I was shrinking. Like I was trying my best to fade to black, fade to the background, nobody sees me, you know, except for those people who were close to me. I really was trying to be unknown. Um, but I love that you were able to take power in your story and finish high school on a positive note. Like, because school could have remained a traumatic experience for you. You know, I know people, when I went back to my 20th high school reunion, it was so many people who did not come. And I know it's a lot of it is because of what they experienced while they were there, right? You know, like you were able to end your, you know, primary education experience in victory. And I think, I think that there's things that we go through even right now, where it's like, even if it's hard right now, I need, I need whatever I'm going through. I need to be able to, I need to put a period on it, and I need a period to say victory. And I think that that's what you were able to do. And I love that. Absolutely love that.

SPEAKER_03 19:37

No, no, I thank God for the victory. And even like even with that victory, I'm I'm still, like I said, still learning and um gaining new victories from like just reflecting back on those experiences I had in high school and in college and in even in residency and medical school. Because even even with finding my kind of voice in myself senior year, like those those remnants of like trauma from being bullied and that kind of stuff, and sometimes fading to the back was still like rear its head and rear its head in med school and residency, even now in the leadership role that I'm at, my current job is still leadership. But the what's it what do people say? What it is, the the leadership.

SPEAKER_01 20:22

Listen, I'm not, I'm not my my college coming out. I'm not that cool. We middle adults, we ain't gotta do the cool stuff.

SPEAKER_03 20:28

I don't try to do the I don't even try to do the cool stuff, but just until then he's like, come on, leadership. Um, even though in my current leadership position, I still sometimes feel myself trying to fade to the to the back. And I actually got re recently got a a word from a trusted um leader and uh spiritual leader in my life who who told me in my

Learning To Step Forward

SPEAKER_03 20:50

ear on a Sunday morning, like, it's time for you to step to the front and stay in the front. And so I'm trying to like tell myself that and not like fade to the back. I know I still I'm still processing that word that I was given. But wait a minute.

SPEAKER_01 21:03

It's time for you to step to the front. Let me ask you something. Do you because I've never seen you as a background person. You know, when I I met Emmanuel freshman year of college, and Emmanuel is two years older than me, um, at least by like the grades when we entered into college. Yeah. Um, and so Emmanuel was always in that crowd of these the people I look up to, you know, like these are the the older folks who will show us the older folks. Like elder millennials, okay, who will show us the way, you know, because the y'all were always teaching us something. Like, come here, babies, let me teach you how to, and this is what you gotta do. I was being serious though, but no, I'm serious like when when we first got the permit I I I understood the season I was in by watching how y'all navigated your season you know by watching how you treated how you were navigating your junior year now I didn't always follow your example because Emmanuel was in that library every day I was you know I was a screensaver every day I was on a screensaver in the library hilarious they were like let me tell you something if Emmanuel ain't nothing he is loyal okay because that man was loyal that JB Duke library okay saw emmanuel chandler there was a little crew and they were all pre-med it was like Emmanuel Jason Joy and uh Monty in that library was he I don't know about I don't know about Monty but I do know in my in my class it was me and my girl charity hey charity we shut that library down uh listen no jason was always there in Joy I do remember Jason and Joy being there all the time Jason and Joy were there for sure Jason and Joy were and and and these people are in the medical profession are in some type of high level profession to this day to this day you know but I think it's so interesting that um that you were you were really um you were really locked in right like you you were really devoted and and consistent and really you know really set on goal oriented and those were the things I saw again I didn't follow okay because most people at Ferman you knew me I was at that library why was I at the library though because I worked there okay that is right but you never saw me in no study room did not you're you saw me behind the counter cutting up okay but but you you guys were pro providing like that vision that that visual example of this is how you we went to a really difficult school you know Furman wasn't no you know I'm saying pass through kind of school it was a it was a you gotta lock in and get it done and so you guys provided the visual and so I've never thought of you because of the way that I met you I've never thought of you as somebody who was trying not to be seen not that you were trying to be seen but I never I never saw you as somebody who wasn't a visual example. And I always even in because I think that there's our perception of ourselves where we're like I don't know if I'm good enough I don't know if I have enough I don't know if I if I could you know do it I don't know if I can carry all this weight I don't know if I can maintain under this pressure right like the these are the internal conversations we're having but the people who are viewing you from the outside are like Emmanuel always has his stuff together Emmanuel's gonna do what's right Emmanuel loves the Lord Emmanuel is super smart right Emmanuel is a great leader Emmanuel is a great husband a great father a great like and and when we think about you we're thinking top of the game top of the game top of the game top of the game and I'm wondering Emmanuel's like but I'm wondering that's why uh before we started recording today I was just like man the pressure the pressure to not that you it took somebody whispering in your ear to say I really see you right every everybody else might be seeing you know the man who who's killing it but I see I see your internal struggle right I see I see what you're not saying you know because nobody most of the people who might have these really high ideas of you they not at the job with you you know they just they just know that's Dr.

SPEAKER_03 25:48

Chandler you know and when

Pressure, Perfection, And Pleasing God

SPEAKER_03 25:50

he rolled through he rolled through but I'm wondering how do you one manage the pressure of it the pressure of people's expectations and your expectations of yourself like through your journey how has that how has that matured grown with you talk to me about pressure yeah that's a great question um I was I you know I think some of the probably the some of the pressure let me I would probably have to go back to Elementary when I was like younger manual around just um and I I don't think it was um intentional pressure from I definitely didn't get pressure from my my parents like my my parents were very very um clear that we are supporting you in your journey whatever it is when it comes down to like my I love that thoughts about first of all one of the greatest homes I know like you got you have a great family I I I I do have a great family you ain't got no evil origin story you know I don't my parents my parents are grounded they are people of integrity they're serving leaders yeah they are just all around good people and so I think that I never felt pressure from them it always came probably from myself in general of having that in that pressure part of I think is that honest like just being honest with myself is growing up in church and and being a church kid I think is always kind of and being in my father's a preacher and preacher's kid like I was one of the best he is one of the best one of the best I wanted to be that kid that did the right thing and always did the right thing. So a little bit of people pleasing in that and also like so putting that internal pressure on myself not really coming from my parents and I'll or anybody else. So I think it was always has always been part of my like I don't know I don't want to say innate character but just like your makeup part of my makeup that I wanted to be the you know do what's right be the good kid. I think we talked a little bit about this before um I think from a church I also probably had like an unhealthy fear of God like the judgment side of God and like okay I got to do what's right I can't make a mistake because if I do God's gonna get me um I need to I need to walk in perfection uh which is unrealistic um as we know and so it wasn't as I grew older and really began to develop my own relationship once again shout out to my parents and to my my faith background my church home about teaching us about having a relationship with God and having a personal relationship starting out as a child like it's not you're not too young to have a personal relationship. As I began to develop that relationship and begin to understand that I don't I don't I don't need to fear God in an unhealthy way but I need to reverence the Lord and and I fell more in love with God and I fell in love with like what he did for me dying on the cross extending grace saving my soul nothing like he not not what he did from blessing and stuff blessings or anything like that but just who he is and what he has done for all of us then I began to kind of reverence have a have a holy reverence and a holy fear for him. And I think that also took off some of the pressure when I began to understand like hey you don't only person I need to please is him and not and I don't have to please people like am I pleasing you God and is this is what I'm doing right not because I want to be right but because I want to please you um and make sure that my life is pleasing to you that and I took I think I shared with this shared this with you before is that my my motto even in high school and middle school was always I'm gonna put God first everything else will follow. And so that's what I think that's what helped me kind of relieve some of the pressure of of pleasing people of trying to do do things the right way of trying to always get it right. It's just really like okay God God doesn't expect us to be perfect. He expects us to be mature and to be become be you stole my point to be to become better but not to be perfect. And so that's why I began to realize like hey do you like this you don't have to put all this pressure like do you do what God has called you to do you're you're capable you're able like you don't have to be you don't you're you don't have to be perfect. And so I think helped me realizing um that I need to stop people pleasing and please God helped me to relieve some of the pressure that I was going through.

SPEAKER_01 30:36

Okay no that's that's so good because I think it's so important to realize like to know where the pressure is coming from and the pressure wasn't coming from all of these external elements it was really it was really how you viewed yourself and how you wanted to be viewed by other people but the only cure for that was really understanding how God really saw you. And God saw you as worthy and redeemed and gifted and his son you know and when you really took that in and locked in on that then you were able to face the world in a way that says it's not me it's God. Yeah it's because I put God first and I'm leading with God first you can't put pressure on me because I'm I'm underneath God. So any pressure that you put that you that you are are projecting it's gonna hit the Lord first. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 31:39

Enricochet back to you.

SPEAKER_01 31:43

I love that but I think yeah no but that's such a that's such a good formula you know because a lot of times you know when we think about you know I think that there's a lot of conversation around the word submission right for a lot of different reasons but everyone is called to submit um every everyone is called to submit to to God to those that he's placed in your life um you you will have to at some point in your life submit and surrender. You got to come up under something and you also have to surrender the things that you were holding on to and I think your story is a beautiful example of a man who decided to do both both to submit himself to God and to surrender those things that you could have held on to you could be prideful about being a doctor you could you know you could be out here telling everybody you know I call him chief you know you could you could be out here telling everybody did you know I'm out here running hospitals okay yes you are out here running delusions okay y'all watch gray's anatomy you know the you know what the chief was doing okay I be out here running things okay and this is why the Lord knows what why not to give me things he be like because Jaquita y'all all I ever wanted from the Lord was to be able to sing real real real real real real good okay and I can sing listen emmanuel Emmanuel stood beside me on the choir for many a year okay we was on that permanent university gospel ensemble right there holding the tennis down the tennis down sharing the note with one another yeah what the note is okay wonderful I was saying whatever Emmanuel was singing that's what I was singing okay um but but I can't sing I tell people I sing well enough that they let me on the choir but they don't pass me the mic um and it's my truth we we all need good background singers and I I'm not a background singer I'm a choir singer okay and I know that okay no this important background singers are are them background singers that they're at the concerts yeah they can sing they they they just working on their solo career okay they're just there for a temporary amount of time I'm with you I'm a choir member okay no manual can manually can hold a little bit more of a tune than me um but you know I I think that that's so good okay I I I'm I'm going back to this uh idea of being raised in a great home because I love both your parents your father has uplifted my spirit in ways I just can't even describe I remember when I first came back from divinity school and we were doing this exercise in ministers classes where we had to write write something positive about everybody in the room and your father said something so insightful and so deep to me I was like I didn't even this but he is a true pastoral presence in a lot of people's lives and when I look at you and you you refer to medicine as a calling right and I'm I'm I'm really big on this we are called to operate we are called to bring the kingdom into our everyday lives right like that that is a huge part of my mission statement that you know we are called to go outside the walls of the church and carry kingdom there. And when you say you're called to medicine like that is that to me is you are bringing God's presence in a place where many people are like my God don't believe in doctor my doctor doesn't believe in the Lord you know my my doctor don't know the Lord my doctor talking to me about science you know I don't know if my doctor pray or not you know I I don't and there's always been this huge division

Faith, Science, And Servant Leadership

SPEAKER_01 35:40

between science and God. But I'm wondering because I really feel like you you kind of have the best of both your parents um I'm I'm wondering growing up what did you glean from having this really great household that has helped you in the spaces that you're in now?

SPEAKER_03 35:59

Oh that's a great question I think you know with my thinks all my questions are great.

SPEAKER_01 36:02

This is wonderful.

SPEAKER_03 36:03

They are a great question. I'm thankful for my parents and they're I think one of the things that I definitely have learned from them is servant leadership and how to serve people and serve people with grace and with respect and with integrity because that those that is who my parents are um they're both they're both servants and they're both servant leaders and they my mom definitely have more has more of an evangelistic kind of call and like really evangelizes people and lifts people up my dad is very much pastoral pastoral um and I get definitely the pastoral side of my dad quite a bit um and even like how I lead him being a servant leader in my space like I'm always trying to like see the best in people and pull out like their innate ability to lead and helping them to where they are and to shepherd them and to move them forward. Same thing with my patients like when I'm working with patients like I'm thinking about like okay how can I help this team you know navigate their teen years and become be the healthiest the healthiest team they can be and um navigate to whatever like whatever chronic medical issue I'm taking care of. Like I take care of patients with eating disorders like how do I help navigate through this through this process. So I think that comes definitely from my parents I'm very much a um my wife calls me honest Sam because I'm very honest. Yes I say things very frankly and who I get that from you probably can guess is my mama uh my mom is gonna be authentically Karen Chandler she's always honest about what she sees because she's gonna she's gonna do it in a loving way but she's gonna be honest and you're gonna hear what she thinks and how she thinks about it. And I I definitely get that from her I think always from a place of love though. Yeah always from a place of love um but I definitely have gotten that and I you I use that in my in my leadership style uh when I lead or when I'm at work I try to be honest with people um I try to be I am honest with people and I but I do it probably in a more diplomatic diplomatic way than maybe my mom uh would do it but um I definitely have have gotten that have gotten that from them I think also my my parents just are authentic people and so I try to be authentic I try to be the same my parents were always this were always the same no matter where they were so if you saw my parents in church when you got to if you came to my house they act this the way they acted church is the way they acted at home. Same. If you saw them at their on their jobs, the way they acted on their jobs the way they acted in church is the way they acted at home. And so my parents taught me manual be authentic like how you be yourself be who God has called you to be um don't try to put on a front don't try to be fake with people like be you and so I try to be me um in whatever space I am like if I'm leading at church if I'm at work if I'm at home if I'm out out hanging out with friends and stuff I'm trying I'm going to be authentically emanal and this is who you're gonna get. It did take me a while to get there because I do think from from the authenticity piece from that bullying in my past I had to like work through that process because I would because of the bullying would sometimes be concerned about okay what do people think about the authentic me. Yeah um but you know I had to still even even through um even though I you know I got worked through it through high school I even had to work through it still through college and through residency and that kind of stuff because immediately when I meet people I'm not the I love talking to people but I'm not the most uh probably initially overtly um what's what I'm looking for um oh man my mind's going blank of the word I'm looking for the extrovert I'm not like overtly extroverted I guess is that the right word to say but uh but once you get to know me I'm like oh okay you're cool but most people think oh you mean it was kind of quiet when you get to know him initially uh because then usually I'm getting that from my dad I'm trying to observe you and like see like okay how how do I navigate you what what type of person are you can I be my authentic self with you can I be honest with you um my dad my dad is extremely observant also and it's kind of a quiet I told you he told me things I never knew I said really he said yeah it was no it was my favorite it was the f my favorite feedback that I received was from your dad yeah and so I I say that all that to say is that sometimes me being quiet sometimes can make seem it's probably me trying to figure out like can I be my authentic self with whoever I'm interacting with.

SPEAKER_01 40:44

Yeah um which sometimes can make me a little bit more reserved but those are just some of the things that I've been able to to learn from my parents but you know one thing I and I think I shared this with you the other day is that my um mom would always tell me growing up that manual I don't put nothing past you um in the sense of like I think we talked about like uh you know this growing up in church and that kind of stuff of mom always tell me I don't put anything past you like all the stuff that's out here in the world smoking drinking you know all the external things that we think about that um but we should do as believers or whatever is like I don't put nothing past you you could you can do any of those things but I need you to know that how you how are you going to handle those things if they come up like if you are like if you are feeling like you want to try X or that you want to have sex with your girlfriend or whatever the case may be like actually stop pump the brakes come talk what's your plan what's your plan yeah my their plan was like pump the brakes what's your plan what are you going to do about that how are you going to not do it but how are you going to avoid walking down that path that you know can be detrimental to your to your walk with Christ it can be detrimental to your future there's consequences to all these things that can happen um and I appreciate my mom and my dad once again being authentic and saying like hey like this is this is um real this is what can happen these are things that happen in our lives like how are you going to navigate these things okay I love that I love that's a lot sorry no no no no no no it was perfect it was perfect because I think sometimes we don't realize first of all that quote that statement from your mom everybody who's parenting teenagers right now if you parented somebody 11 and up in this generation that's something that you really those are real conversations that you need to be having with them and sometimes because uh kids like a lot of us who are like highly successful right now when we were growing up a lot of times we seemed like the oh they would never kiss you know they would never and we did yeah you thought we would never but people was back there you know and it's because nobody pulled them to the side and said I know I know you you doing well and you I'm not saying that you know that you you looking to go this way but but even when you're not looking for it it may find you what you gonna do what and and the critical thinking that we need more of in this present generation it happens when we start when we start walking our kids through those real conversations so kudos to mom Chandler for really being able to sit you down because you are a yes you are a good kid who has really found God and really is endeavoring to seek after God and has put God first in your life right but but and also you are you are a you are a kid. Yeah right you you are a growing man.

SPEAKER_02 43:55

Right.

SPEAKER_01 43:55

I mean not now then I gotta Right, you're a growing man. And so how do we how do we build foundations? And

Parenting Gen Alpha With A Strong Why

SPEAKER_01 44:05

this you're leading me because we're we're moving from first act, right? And and I'm starting to think about second act because it's really been on my heart here lately about the shift for middle adults. And the shift for middle adults that has occurred is that we went from being the brother sister to Gen Z, like, hey y'all, what's going on? I'm gonna help y'all out, to now being the parents of Gen Alpha and Jen Beta, right? And you don't have to be, you don't have to have physical children in your life to be out here parenting a generation. Okay, for those of us who do any type of mentorship, if you are auntie, an uncle, if you big cuz, you know, like we we are parenting a generation. Um, and the reason why I love your story so much is because you have such a strong foundation of being parented, right? And I'm and I'm interested to know because I think that there's so much for all of us to learn. How does your foundation show up in the second act of your own parenting now? Now that you got talk about talk about the kiddos. Okay, and Janet. Hey Nate, love you, Nate.

SPEAKER_03 45:20

Let me let me let me first say this. I think having a uh a God ordained marriage and parent to parent our children uh has been the greatest blessing of my life because I I would not want to parent my kids without Jeannay. Um if anyone knows Jeanne, Jeanne is like as we like to call her, or y'all like to call her.

SPEAKER_01 45:46

Save Nay.

SPEAKER_03 45:47

Save Nay.

SPEAKER_01 45:48

Save Nay. Let me tell you something. I y'all think now we're sitting here talking about, you know, a church kid and Emmanuel grew up in the Lord and dah du. Let me tell you something. When I first met Jeanne, I was like, this girl ain't seen nothing but the Lord since she was four. Okay, she came to college like who is Usher? And we were like, all right.

SPEAKER_03 46:13

We still work at our people.

SPEAKER_01 46:15

She'd be like, no, who sings that song again? Is that um Rihanna?

SPEAKER_03 46:18

She'll know. She'll she'll know.

SPEAKER_01 46:21

Yeah, Janet was like, I was speaking in tongues at four.

SPEAKER_02 46:26

That's so true. But I love my wife.

SPEAKER_03 46:28

But she like, I mean, number one is having like a strong, a strong, I say co-parent, but for me is having a strong wife, um, who to raise my to raise my kids with uh is been extremely important. And I and and I'll say like having a saved wife. Um because I think in the culture that we're that our kids are being raised in, it's important to give them the foundation that they need. And so what to answer your question, one of the things that I've been be trying we have tried, not me, just we have tried to be intentional with is to ensure that our kids have a strong foundation in God, the same way, the same way uh my in-laws did for Janae and my parents did for me. That we haven't tried to be really intentional with our kids. Uh and I was actually more more recently, I was praying about uh about my kids and just some of the things they were going through. And the Lord shared with me, like, hey, I need you to make sure they not only believe in me, but they know why they believe in me. Like, you know, pretty much the apologetics of Christianity. Like, why, why does how do we know that God exists? You know, why do we serve God? How do we know that He is God? And so, I mean, I and I had a conversation, so I like, you know, the Lord spoke, I said, okay, let me test this out. And I asked my my oldest uh child, I said, Isabella, do you know why we um believe you know that Jesus is God? And she was like, I mean, kind of, but not maybe not all the way. And I was like, okay, we got some work to do.

SPEAKER_01 47:57

Work, we got work, we got work to do.

SPEAKER_03 47:59

And so in that moment, we had a conversation just talking about, you know, we just give going through the basics of you know, understanding who God is and understanding God the Father, God the Son, God the Spirit, and understanding like Jesus died for us. And she knew those things, but just kind of understanding, um, answering some of her questions. And it wasn't a long, it wasn't a long conversation. It was like maybe a five-minute conversation, but just starting to plant those seeds now has been, I think, is really important to myself and Shine because with Isabella, we have eight more years. So with I with Isaiah, we have what, uh 10 more years before they leave the house and go to college. And I need my kids in this culture to know without a shadow of a doubt, why they worship who they worship, why it will sustain them, why he, why I say it, why God will sustain them. You know, I would I need to know them. I need to for them to know who their identity is found in, uh, because there's gonna the culture is coming for them. Even now, culture is coming for them, and we're having to combat different things that they see on TV and things they see in the world and all those things. So I need my kids to to understand that. So the same thing my parents did with me, I'm having those those conversations, you know, of course, age-appropriate conversations of my kids about who God is and how to um how to navigate the world they're in, the culture that they're currently in.

SPEAKER_01 49:26

What parts, no, that's fantastic. What parts when as you're watching your kids grow, what parts of their lives mirror your own growth and development at their age that you're having to parent them through? Are pieces of yourself that you see in your kids and you're like, oh, wait a minute, I need to, I recognize that.

SPEAKER_03 49:47

Okay. So the part that I'm parenting in my own kids is what you're asking me, right? That I'm pulling from my um, I think with my son, my son is different, and I love I love his uniqueness. So when I say he's different, like this kid, let me see the story about my my my kids. My my oldest child is extremely athletic, and took her to a basketball uh event or a basketball thing that uh one of our neighbors, our community um people were doing, and it was at that point she was like five or six, and Isaiah was four maybe. So the fella goes in, gets the basketball immediately. Like we like, whoo, this girl. Okay, wait a minute. She got some skills. The ball, he cool, yes, great ball. He says, hmm. He stumps, he hits the floor, he says, This is wood. I'm like, oh okay. He like he was not interested in a basketball, and then he's like, he's just been a different kid. And um I I watch him try to how he's navigating that difference. I remember being a kid like that, having to navigate that difference. And so I'm using what I learned when I'm like, oh, I'm I'm different. Like I don't necessarily always fit in um with the crowd. I'm a little different from from my cousins and things of that nature. And I realize Isaiah is also navigating that too, of being being just having this uniqueness about himself that I'm trying to help him navigate. Um I think with my with my oldest child, once again, I I like being able to kind of sometimes be in the background and fit in and that kind of stuff. And my oldest child likes it also, and she my she's a very popular kid. Like people, however, they gravitate towards she that girl. She she's that girl, but she also likes to blend in and like kind of um assimilate. So yeah, assimilate is a great word. Yeah, it doesn't always like to show her uniqueness and who she is. So I'm trying to teach her that hey, it's okay to stand out, it's okay to be different, like her. And I say me, we, me and myself and myself and Janay are trying to teach her that it's okay to be different. It's okay to stand out. And I'll tell you, my wife is much better in like standing at her her own uniqueness and being.

SPEAKER_01 52:18

Always has been.

SPEAKER_03 52:19

Always has been, continues to be okay with that.

SPEAKER_01 52:22

She don't care nothing, she don't care nothing about how much I have picked on Jeanne since 2005. Okay, and they ain't done a

Raising Kids Set Apart

SPEAKER_01 52:30

thing.

SPEAKER_03 52:31

But I I I sometimes have to be like, okay, man, it's okay, it's okay to be different, it's okay to be unique. Um, and so I I'm having to make sure that Isabella makes that she knows that it's okay to be different and to be unique and to be bold. Like one thing that we don't do, now I'm sharing this because most people know that we don't celebrate Halloween, right?

SPEAKER_02 52:50

And so holiness is right because holiness is right.

SPEAKER_03 52:55

And so uh, and then to those who celebrate Halloween out there, that's on you, you know, that's your own little uh uh talk with the Lord. Prerogative prerogative. But over here we don't celebrate Halloween, but you know, for Isabella that was difficult to navigate um and trying to understand that and like because you know that that we want to fit in and not to stand out, not to be different, like we had to really walk her through that and still have to walk her through that, even though we've been doing this now for you know, ever since she's been in high in school, because our our local school that we go to, they have a whole like parade for like to show off the costumes, all that kind of stuff. And we're like, no, no, you're not gonna participate. Or if you do want to participate, you're gonna be you. You're gonna wear your normal regular clothes, we're not dressing up. Um, and so she has to like we have to help her walk through that and help explain like this is why we don't do these things. Others may, but you may not. And this is um, and that's okay. The others may and you may not. And this is why we don't do those things. Um, and so just having just having to navigate some of those things and navigate, you know, being different, being set apart, um, being holy. Um is something that we're trying to try to teach our teach my teach my kids and things that I had to learn that and be okay with throwing up too.

SPEAKER_01 54:12

I love that. I I I love that. So I I kind of made parenting your second act, but I'm realizing that there's a lot going on in your world and in your life, right? I want to ask the question: how has your understanding of success shifted in the in this second half of your kind of middle adult years versus when you were maybe in your 20s?

SPEAKER_03 54:44

I mean, success for me looked like accolades, right? It looked like achieving my goals. That's what success looked like. So I wanted to necessarily, I wouldn't say accolades, but really achieving my goals. And then the accolades that came with it, that was nice, right? So becoming a physician, success, right? Um being a um getting through pediatric residency successfully, success. Being able to get through fellowship, success, starting a faculty position, you know, with with my faculty position because I work in academic medicine, I have to write papers, I have to teach, I have to also see patients. So being able to be successful in those in those realms and get promoted from assistant professor to associate professor, look, those things look like success to me. Um, and I, you know, I honestly had to come to grips of what success looks like and what God calls success and what like how like how he measures our success. Probably in in in now, like, you know, recently, you know, I got promoted, I was getting, you know, it was very unusual my trajectory through academic medicine. When I finished fellowship, I became an associate member, I became a medical director immediately, which is very unheard of to go into operational leadership right out of fellowship. And then I became um a uh associate division director. Then I became a division director, which and I'm only I'm only 41 years old. And that's my God. People are becoming division directors like usually later in their career, like later in their 40s, early 50s, that type of thing. I'm one of the youngest division directors at the institution that I work with, work at. Like, even where I am right now, like great, yes, I love it. I'm a division director, I am a father, I'm a husband, um, and all these things, but what what more do you have for me? And where, like, where do you want to take my family? So success looks like for me is being in the will of God for myself, being in the will of God for my family's sake. Like I want to make sure that we're walking in alignment with him, um, which takes a lot of humility and a lot of submission because um sometimes, you know, I think what we think as success or what I've thought as success uh in the past, now doesn't it doesn't always mean like, yes, I have, you know, I've accomplished all these things, but um I just always want to make sure that I'm in the will of the will of God in every area of my life, like being a father, being a husband, being being a physician. Like, is my life

Redefining Success In Midlife

SPEAKER_03 57:40

aligned with where you're wanting me to go? And am I staying in alignment in that space?

SPEAKER_01 57:45

What do you what do you feel like the Lord is requiring of you in this season?

SPEAKER_03 57:53

Oh man, he's requiring me to spend more time with him. Um I think that's the one thing I've been working on is like my uh my time with the Lord. Because I sometimes I look back and I'm like, man, I remember when um Corey, uh who's one of the elders at our at my home church at Goshfield Assembly, will always, and I was in in his Sunday school class, will always tell us, like, your teen years, your college years, your single years is the time you should be spending as much time with the Lord as possible. And I'm gonna do that.

SPEAKER_01 58:27

Let me tell you.

SPEAKER_03 58:30

You hear that, you're like, okay, I'm gonna do it, I'm gonna do it. Because he's like, when you get married, when you have children, like that time looks different, your time looks different. And I'm like, now I'm in that in that space. I'm like, this is so true. Because I feel like the Lord is requiring me, requiring me to spend more time with him. I'm like, wait a minute, Lord, when I supposed to do this. I don't, I'm not a morning person. I don't like to get up. My God, today. I'm not a I'm not a 5 a.m. worshiper. I'm not I'm not that. My wife is. My wife will worship at 5 a.m. She's gonna have a quiet time. You hear me? Let me tell you something, and it ain't always quiet. It is not always quiet. But so she's gonna get up, but I'm not, I'm not that guy. Like, I'm like, okay, Lord, let me find time to spend with you. But I that's one thing he's requiring more of me is more of my time. Um uh more sacrifice of like, you know, things not less, less of what I want, less of what Emmanuel wants, but more of like what he wants. Um, if that makes sense. Um so yeah, those are two, those are the two of the things that God is requiring of me, more of me.

SPEAKER_01 59:35

You know, it's it's interesting because as you're talking, I'm realizing that you are in an intermission moment, like in your journey. Like you are, you know, you had a first act that has uh a really, really rich storyline. And a lot of people look and be like, no, he's in his second act, right? Like he is, he has arrived, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:00:00

Well you when you when you sorry to interrupt you, when you when I was thinking about this and you asked me to be on the second act, I was I kept asking myself, I was like, I don't know if I'm in my second act. But that's okay. But and I and I agree with you, I think wholeheartedly think I'm like I'm in an intermission season in my life. But yeah, sorry, continue.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:18

No, but I I think it's such a it's first of all, it is a strong message to other middle adult people who are in their 40s, who have gotten to a place where it is, okay, Lord, I've done these things. What now? Right? I I'm feeling the pull to more, I'm feeling the call to more, I'm feeling the stretching, I'm feeling the pulling, and I'm also feeling like this life that I built, that I've really gotten very comfortable in, like I feel like you are really calling me to draw in so that I can go deeper in you and come up a little bit higher. Um, and and what I'm discerning in this moment is that you are at, you are exactly at that space where the Lord has allowed, he's still allowing the show to go on. He just pulled you off the stage. Like everything is still running, right? The job's still running, the family's still running, every everything's still going, right? The show is still going on, but he's like, hey, I just need you to come backstage for just a minute. I I need to pull your ear, I need to pull you aside because what I have for you next is going to require such a higher level of purpose and um just direct redirecting your energy in a way that if you don't take this time with God now, it will be a struggle for where he's taking you. If you and and and I think it's such an important message to everyone that's listening, that that is feeling that tug, that is feeling that pull to say, hey, sacrifice. I know that the show is still going forward, right? I know that the family, you know, the kids is still needing you, the job is still needing you, you still got stuff to do at the church, you still got stuff to do just in your everyday life. I know you got all this stuff going on. Trust me to keep that running. I need you. I I I have to pull you, I have to pull you in this moment so that I can prepare you, like the like the uh our our our lead-in says, right? God is about to rewrite your next, right? And it's it's gonna be something, it's not gonna be something alien, but it is gonna be something different. And so that's what that's what the podcast is actually about. It is not about how glorious your second act is, it is about the process that it really takes for and the and and everybody, I you know, I said that I wanted you on the episode because I said, Emmanuel, everybody sees the glory. They don't know the story, right? They don't know what the moments require. And this is a moment where three years from now, everybody's gonna be like looking at you saying, Wow, I can't believe God did that. And you're gonna look back at this moment and you're gonna be like, you don't know what it took to find, like to really take the time and really settle in with God for a season to hear him in a new way, to see my life in a new way, to be able to lead in a new way so that I could get to this point. And you're at the moment before the moment. And I think that's such a beautiful place to be. And it's a place that a lot of us are in right now. Most it that that is middle of those. It's the very, it's in the word, middle.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:52

You know, we always love it all, yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:54

Yeah. Um but I I I love your story because you have such a, you know, you have such a beautiful and rich history, and you're standing on such firm ground, and you what what is ahead, you have to believe that what God put under you is also what he put ahead of you. And so what God put, the firm foundation that God gave you and the story that he gave you, you can trust that you can walk on the water because where he bought you from, he's it's gonna travel with you and be under your feet as you go into something that you've never you've never endeavored into before. And you can trust that everything that that you came from will be waiting on you in the next season of your life.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:43

Yeah. I am excited. I'm excited for. I really appreciate that just word and confirmation of where I'm going and where I know God is trying to take me next. Um yeah, so I definitely realize that I'm in in an intermission season. I'm you know trying to be patient and um wait on the Lord. Wait on the Lord. I think in this, and I think that's where that word that I mentioned earlier, well about come to the come of what the the person spoke to me about. It's time for you to come to the front and stay in the front. I think that's where that um where the where the where the the next second act is coming in at. Um I'm just trying to you know seek the Lord about what he's saying there and um and those types of things.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:32

Listen, I love it. Okay, y'all. This has been an amazing story. I think Emmanuel gave us a lot. Okay, he gave us a lot, and so I'm I'm super grateful. Um, Emmanuel, the people may want it. Listen, Emmanuel is top-tier adolescent medicine professional, okay. I can't wait to have some little teenagers so I can call him and ask him all my questions. Okay. All right, Emmanuel. So if the people want to find you on the socials, where can they do that at?

Where To Find Him And Final Charge

SPEAKER_03 1:06:05

You can find me on Instagram as E C the M D. So it's E C T H E M D.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:11

First of all, that's a really cute name. I like the Chana come up with that.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:15

You know it. I know she did. She's a marketing professional.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:19

I know she did. That is so cute. I love it. E at EC the M D, go follow him. All right. He is going to make sure that that page is giving something to the people.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:30

I need to, I need to, I need to get it more active. I will work on that.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:34

Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Perfect, perfect. Emmanuel, thank you so much. This is, I know that you feel really good about being here, but I feel so good about having somebody who was this invested in the podcast to really come. Because you're the reason why we made the podcast. Like, you're the reason when we say it's a labor of love, we are thinking about what it is doing in the lives of people who are taking it and really, really thinking through their intermission moments.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:02

Really, really processing what God is doing and how God is rewriting your story and getting you to your next level. Like, yeah. So I just, we, I cannot tell you enough how much we appreciate your support, how much I appreciate who you are and who you've been through the years. You are absolutely top tier.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:20

Same to you, Quita. I appreciate the opportunity to be here. And thanks for listening, everybody.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:25

Yay! All right. So listen, friends, you do not have to stay stuck in your intermission. You can raise the curtain to your second act, friends. We will see y'all on the next episode.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:41

Thank you once again for listening to the Unlearned Podcast. We would love to hear your comments and your feedback about the episode. Feel free to follow us on Facebook and Instagram, and to let us know what you think. We're looking forward to the next time when we are able to unlearn together to move forward towards freedom. See you then.